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Queue wait time - WG completely missed the point...


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vvk2 #1 Posted 21 September 2019 - 11:09 PM

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Trying to play the realistic mode got me thinking.

So whoever tried to get to the realistic battles now would definitely know how painful it is. And I am not referring to the gameplay. I am referring to the wait time. It is simple horrible. And I know that the standard answer is that especially on the NA server, there are not enough online players. But I think it is not the root of the problem. it is more of a symptom. 

First, I've seen a number of times when there were clearly enough players in the queue waiting and yet it would take MM quite some time (sometime more than a minute) to actually build the matchup. Sometime you can see that the players would actually leave the queue hence it would be too late for MM to build the teams. With all due respect I don't understand what takes that long. Even with some complex rules for MM (that we suspect exist yet WG says it is all random) with modern compute power it should not take more than a sec to build workable teams. In cases when there is actually not enough players to have 7v7, WG actually already developed a solution - smaller teams of 3v3, 4v4 or 5v5. Those can easily be enabled for the realistic battles for example. 

What I see it that WG doesn't understand the issue of the long wait time and how frustrating it is. What is the point of having developed a new game mode if a player has to sit in a queue for 5 min. With an average battle lasting under 3 min, waiting for even 1 min is too long. And I don't think WG get this, otherwise given how easy it could be fixed, it would have been addressed.

 

 

 


Edited by vvk2, 21 September 2019 - 11:10 PM.


AKWolf1 #2 Posted 21 September 2019 - 11:26 PM

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This mode is dead.  Wait times for normal battles is nothing, ratings battles maybe 30-seconds, and realistic I gave up with a paltry 4 players in the 9-10 que.  

acrisis #3 Posted 21 September 2019 - 11:41 PM

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WG simply drove away too many veterans and players of all levels with a variety of short sighted updates and made a hot mess of things. Realistic mode is a very late answer to requests made years ago, and arriving too late to make a difference. 

 

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Mako__Reizei___ #4 Posted 22 September 2019 - 02:33 AM

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Gave up trying to play my E-100 after having to wait for half an hour just to get in a match. We need players playing this mode smh.

Must. Have. 60%. Winrate. Under. 0.5%. Platoon. Rate!!! (30 day)

 

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djhiz #5 Posted 22 September 2019 - 03:25 AM

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View PostMako__Reizei___, on 22 September 2019 - 02:33 AM, said:

Gave up trying to play my E-100 after having to wait for half an hour just to get in a match. We need players playing this mode smh.

Maybe mission requiring it?


 

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ZebraUp #6 Posted 22 September 2019 - 10:49 AM

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Perhaps make realistic only tier 8 and ratings battles only tier 10.

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__V_O_P__ #7 Posted 22 September 2019 - 12:59 PM

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View Postvvk2, on 21 September 2019 - 11:09 PM, said:

 

With all due respect I don't understand what takes that long. Even with some complex rules for MM (that we suspect exist yet WG says it is all random) with modern compute power it should not take more than a sec to build workable teams.  

 

WG has never said this. MM takes into account many things that are not random. For example, tanks in the queue, the maps you’ve played recently, people you played against maybe.

 

There are now three battle modes (four if you include mad) that are user selectable. That choice comes at a cost. Fewer maps or less balanced teams (from a tank perspective) might make it faster but comes at a different cost.

 

It’s all a compromise. 

 



vvk2 #8 Posted 22 September 2019 - 01:50 PM

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View Post__V_O_P__, on 22 September 2019 - 07:59 AM, said:

 

WG has never said this. MM takes into account many things that are not random. For example, tanks in the queue, the maps you’ve played recently, people you played against maybe.

 

 

http://forum.wotblitz.com/index.php?/topic/86788-official-matchmaking-discussion-thread/

This is the consolidated post of what is confirmed to be considered and NOT in the MM.

 

 

View Post__V_O_P__, on 22 September 2019 - 07:59 AM, said:

 

There are now three battle modes (four if you include mad) that are user selectable. That choice comes at a cost. Fewer maps or less balanced teams (from a tank perspective) might make it faster but comes at a different cost.

 

It’s all a compromise. 

 

 

and this is exactly my point, the compromise WG is offering is completely off the mark - what is the point of having a new game mode with these wait times? And not enough players is not an excuse as there are options to reduce the wait time. WG just chose not to use them, hence my point - WG doesn’t truly understand what players really need. 


Edited by vvk2, 22 September 2019 - 01:59 PM.


__V_O_P__ #9 Posted 22 September 2019 - 01:57 PM

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View Postvvk2, on 22 September 2019 - 01:50 PM, said:


and this is exactly my point, the compromise WG is offering is completely off the mark - what is the point of having a new game mode with these wait times? And not enough players is not an excuse as there are options to reduce the wait time. WG just chose not to use them, hence my point - WG doesn’t truly understand what players really need. 

 

That’s what you want. Presumably WG is juggling variety (maps et al) and wait time. If there were more players wait times would be shorter. Without more players what are you willing to give up? Map

choice? Tank selection? 



vvk2 #10 Posted 22 September 2019 - 02:04 PM

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View Post__V_O_P__, on 22 September 2019 - 08:57 AM, said:

 

That’s what you want. Presumably WG is juggling variety (maps et al) and wait time. If there were more players wait times would be shorter. Without more players what are you willing to give up? Map

choice? Tank selection? 

I believe there is nothing worse than waiting for too long (which could be different for different players of course). I see players dropping off the queue and I know they after some point they wont back which defeats the whole purpose of having a new mode... On the other hand if there is no issue of the waiting, then people will come and stay - if a new mode is something worth playing



__V_O_P__ #11 Posted 22 September 2019 - 05:57 PM

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View Postvvk2, on 22 September 2019 - 02:04 PM, said:

I believe there is nothing worse than waiting for too long (which could be different for different players of course). I see players dropping off the queue and I know they after some point they wont back which defeats the whole purpose of having a new mode... On the other hand if there is no issue of the waiting, then people will come and stay - if a new mode is something worth playing

 

No one wants to wait too long. No one wants unbalanced teams. No one wants to play the same maps with the same players over and over again. It’s all a compromise. 

 

Perhaps the reason you’re waiting so long is that realistic battles are not popular. 



vvk2 #12 Posted 22 September 2019 - 06:30 PM

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View Post__V_O_P__, on 22 September 2019 - 12:57 PM, said:

 

No one wants to wait too long. No one wants unbalanced teams. No one wants to play the same maps with the same players over and over again. It’s all a compromise. 

 

Perhaps the reason you’re waiting so long is that realistic battles are not popular. 

 

Well, none of the factors you mention has anything to do with the wait time:

- Team balancing: Beyond the tier balancing, the only balancing that MM does (officially) is the tank type, and only to a degree: that each team would have similar amount of the same tank types. If the queue is large enough it would also limit the number of tank per type - however this doesn't apply to the realistic now and I saw teams with 6 lights/meds per team. With any given combination of tanks types with a given tier bracket (say 5-6), you can easily come up with balanced teams - you don't need a Math degree do figure that out.

- Map rotation. First, previous maps aren't part of the MM criteria, however even if it was, given that the same group of players often end up in the same battles (and this is certainly the case for the current state of the NA blitz, even for the random battles) the map rotation is no issue.

- The same player is not an issue I am referring to here and it happens all the time and has nothing to do with the wait time.

 

And the final and most important point - none of that matters if you cannot get into a battle due to the super long wait time. So this is not about a compromise - this is a decisive factor that basically defeats the purpose of the game mode...

and yes, the realistic battles aren't popular and in part due to the long wait time so this is a catch 22. However, if WG really understood this, they have ways to help here. and that is what I am trying to say.

 

 


Edited by vvk2, 22 September 2019 - 06:33 PM.


EricOtown #13 Posted 23 September 2019 - 04:22 PM

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I often wonder the same thing when playing realistic mode and whenever I screw around in the lower tiers 1-3. I’ve waited 10 minutes for a tier 1 match during a peak time of day. Tier 1 isn’t worth that wait, but I was determined to see how long it would take for the match to be made and the battle to start. 

 

As far as how long it takes their server computers to apply MM rules and form a team, its gotta be fractions of a second. A computer can solve sophisticated match problems almost instantaneously so applying a simple algorithm of “if then” rules should take no time at all. 

 

Its not the algorithm computing process that’s taking so long, it’s finding 14 tanks that fit all of the MM rules which includes tiers, tanks types, preferential MM rules for special tanks and new tanks, and whatever else is included in the MM algorithm.

 

So even though you see enough tanks in the que, there I need be enough tanks that fit the MM algorithms.


Edited by EricOtown, 23 September 2019 - 04:23 PM.


wrecker1968 #14 Posted 23 September 2019 - 05:05 PM

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I think the mistake WG  Developers made, was to listen to the professional players at the tournaments. Without taken into account that they are only less and 10% of the playerbase. They never took the time to listen to the average player. And now a lot of those average players are walking. And if they want to  Stop them from walking or get them to come back to the game. WG will have to go above and beyond. Because those players were the ones that invested in this company. An thought It was going get better rather than worse. I spent money on this game With the thought that it was either going to stay the same or get better. Wow I was wrong.

Edited by wrecker1968, 23 September 2019 - 05:07 PM.


__V_O_P__ #15 Posted 23 September 2019 - 05:41 PM

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View Postvvk2, on 22 September 2019 - 06:30 PM, said:

 

Well, none of the factors you mention has anything to do with the wait time:

- Team balancing: Beyond the tier balancing, the only balancing that MM does (officially) is the tank type, and only to a degree: that each team would have similar amount of the same tank types. If the queue is large enough it would also limit the number of tank per type - however this doesn't apply to the realistic now and I saw teams with 6 lights/meds per team. With any given combination of tanks types with a given tier bracket (say 5-6), you can easily come up with balanced teams - you don't need a Math degree do figure that out.

- Map rotation. First, previous maps aren't part of the MM criteria, however even if it was, given that the same group of players often end up in the same battles (and this is certainly the case for the current state of the NA blitz, even for the random battles) the map rotation is no issue.

- The same player is not an issue I am referring to here and it happens all the time and has nothing to do with the wait time.

 

And the final and most important point - none of that matters if you cannot get into a battle due to the super long wait time. So this is not about a compromise - this is a decisive factor that basically defeats the purpose of the game mode...

and yes, the realistic battles aren't popular and in part due to the long wait time so this is a catch 22. However, if WG really understood this, they have ways to help here. and that is what I am trying to say.

 

 

 

You think you are waiting for what then? Godot?



9_V0LT #16 Posted 23 September 2019 - 06:57 PM

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View Post__V_O_P__, on 23 September 2019 - 05:41 PM, said:

 

You think you are waiting for what then? Godot?


Gal Gadot is worth the wait. 


Yeah, I'm back. Let's not make a big deal about this.





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