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richdubz #21 Posted 30 January 2020 - 11:51 AM

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I’ve been playing mostly tiers 8 and 9 since they came out, and I’m seeing fewer of them now than I did in the first days of the introduction. When I see an ATGM in red, I’m quite honestly more worried about their guns than I am their missiles.

 


_Crusader6_ #22 Posted 30 January 2020 - 03:29 PM

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Show me a player that statistically over performs in an ATGM tank from their recent tier performance.

 

ANY of the Unicum clan stats show in the 60-75%'s the tank marginally underperforms.

 

 

 


 

 
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j_rod #23 Posted 30 January 2020 - 03:35 PM

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View Post__Crusader6__, on 30 January 2020 - 09:29 AM, said:

Show me a player that statistically over performs in an ATGM tank from their recent tier performance.

 

ANY of the Unicum clan stats show in the 60-75%'s the tank marginally underperforms.

 

 

 


Here’s a quick one. Note the survival rate specifically.

 

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RonaldusMaximus_ #24 Posted 30 January 2020 - 03:37 PM

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View Post__Crusader6__, on 30 January 2020 - 10:29 AM, said:

Show me a player that statistically over performs in an ATGM tank from their recent tier performance.

 

ANY of the Unicum clan stats show in the 60-75%'s the tank marginally underperforms.

 

 

 

 

IMHO the problem with the ATGM tanks are NOT the ATGMs. The problem is the effect they are having on the players that have been able to rush up to tier X in record time. Those who have learned nothing and treat tier X like tier 5. Now they arrive in tier X in their super heavies and cower at the edge of the map for fear of becoming a big HP sandwich for the ATGMs to munch on.

 

It is as if all the bad decisions WG has made to date have accumulated into a puss filled boil and is ready to explode at any moment.


 


_Crusader6_ #25 Posted 30 January 2020 - 04:21 PM

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View PostRonaldusMaximus_, on 30 January 2020 - 10:37 AM, said:

 

IMHO the problem with the ATGM tanks are NOT the ATGMs. The problem is the effect they are having on the players that have been able to rush up to tier X in record time. Those who have learned nothing and treat tier X like tier 5. Now they arrive in tier X in their super heavies and cower at the edge of the map for fear of becoming a big HP sandwich for the ATGMs to munch on.

 

It is as if all the bad decisions WG has made to date have accumulated into a puss filled boil and is ready to explode at any moment.


I have a plethora of screenshots from 2014-16 with heavies camping spawn.  
  I don’t see a change honestly. 
 

It is a mobile game, expecting more than a few folks to care in it, is an exercise in futility.   
 


 

 
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RonaldusMaximus_ #26 Posted 30 January 2020 - 04:26 PM

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View Post__Crusader6__, on 30 January 2020 - 11:21 AM, said:


I have a plethora of screenshots from 2014-16 with heavies camping spawn.  
  I don’t see a change honestly. 
 

It is a mobile game, expecting more than a few folks to care in it, is an exercise in futility.   
 

 

I would like to see in a few weeks the numbers of heavy tanks at tier X pre and post update.  In nearly every tier X game I have played, the Heavies are either hiding or not even in the match.


 


j_rod #27 Posted 30 January 2020 - 04:48 PM

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Here's a telling stat and take from it what you will - the T92E1 has the fourth highest survival rate of any tier 9 tank...as an LT. Granted, there are only 2033 players so one could assume that more skilled players in general are playing it with it being a new release, but it's almost six percent higher than the next highest med/light which is the 30 1er. 

 

Here are a few more things to consider -

 

* It has 10% lower hitrate than any other med/light, but has the highest DPB, DR, KPB and KDR. 

* It has the lowest potential DPM of any other med/light, but the second highest actual DPM 

 

Oh yeah, and this isn't taking in to consideration the 25% hitrate for the ATGMs. While we don't know what percentage of shots are utilizing the missiles, what this tells us is that the effectiveness of the shots that do hit (regardless of ammo type) is way too high. 


Edited by j_rod, 30 January 2020 - 04:50 PM.

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_Crusader6_ #28 Posted 30 January 2020 - 06:35 PM

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View Postj_rod, on 30 January 2020 - 11:48 AM, said:

Here's a telling stat and take from it what you will - the T92E1 has the fourth highest survival rate of any tier 9 tank...as an LT. Granted, there are only 2033 players so one could assume that more skilled players in general are playing it with it being a new release, but it's almost six percent higher than the next highest med/light which is the 30 1er. 

 

Here are a few more things to consider -

 

* It has 10% lower hitrate than any other med/light, but has the highest DPB, DR, KPB and KDR. 

* It has the lowest potential DPM of any other med/light, but the second highest actual DPM 

 

Oh yeah, and this isn't taking in to consideration the 25% hitrate for the ATGMs. While we don't know what percentage of shots are utilizing the missiles, what this tells us is that the effectiveness of the shots that do hit (regardless of ammo type) is way too high. 


The T92E1 will get a nerf - tier for tier it is better than the Sheridan, the DPM drop doesn't offset it's other aspects.  No other tier 9 light or med has the same pen as it's tier X sibling (except the Cent 7/1).

  But if I look at my 30-60-90 data in tier 9, it generally underperforms for me - that said I don't platoon in it, so I could up some results playing with a good toonmate.

 

Better players will have exceedingly high SR's for Light tanks - as they can "abuse" camouflage and spotting mechanics better than the rest of the players - thus landing hits while not getting hit more often than naught.

  The "Derp" nature of the T49 has proven that for years - as it has my highest SR in light tanks (above tier 6, and more than 100 battles) and has 830 games.

  

 

   


 

 
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twirlingtowardsfreedom #29 Posted 30 January 2020 - 06:49 PM

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View Postj_rod, on 30 January 2020 - 04:48 PM, said:

Here's a telling stat and take from it what you will - the T92E1 has the fourth highest survival rate of any tier 9 tank...as an LT. Granted, there are only 2033 players so one could assume that more skilled players in general are playing it with it being a new release, but it's almost six percent higher than the next highest med/light which is the 30 1er. 

 

 

 

Survival isn't as tied to winning in a light as it is in other tank classes. I'm not doing well at all in the T92E1 (but having fun and working at it), and it has the lowest WR for me of any of my tier nines. Yet its survival rate is one of my best for the tier, simply because I can leverage its adaptability to stay alive in supremacy games, even if the match is over.



Boomer625 #30 Posted 31 January 2020 - 06:01 AM

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I have just recently got the t9 atgm and is using atgms for penning EXP’s frontally so far. I can do behind cover shots using atgms in training rooms on big rocks only so far.

XSleighSlayer #31 Posted 31 January 2020 - 07:45 PM

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The first time I got the derp gun at the t92, I couldn't hit ANYTHING with the missles, so I decided to abonded them. And I actually did good! But after learning some tactics, now I kinda think that I am a pro at using the missles, I still cant time the shooting from a corner, but other than that I can easily shoot behind a cover, and once I won a 2 vs 5 thanks to the missles, I sniped the 4 guys from a hill and did like 5,5k damage and won. 

Edited by XSleighSlayer, 31 January 2020 - 07:46 PM.


Dwemer_ #32 Posted 13 February 2020 - 08:43 PM

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View PostDefaultz, on 29 January 2020 - 03:32 AM, said:

Playing tier 7 and below is a hard counter to missiles. Any other idea has fallacies.

 Playing at any teir is hard to counter missiles. The tank with the thickest armor plate that can be researched that I found was only 310 mm thick and the shillelagh missiles have an average penetration of 350 mm. Honestly they should’ve never added them and if they did they should’ve gave them to the KPFPZ 70 because the MGM 51 shillelagh missiles that the T91 And the Sheridan both use was originally developed for use by Kpf only.



AdderaII #33 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:09 PM

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If Wargaming wants missiles, fine, but put them on something with the armor equivalent of a Willies Jeep, not something with the effective armor of a Leopard 1

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j_rod #34 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:18 PM

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View PostAdderaII, on 13 February 2020 - 04:09 PM, said:

If Wargaming wants missiles, fine, but put them on something with the armor equivalent of a Willies Jeep, not something with the effective armor of a Leopard 1


They might as well as artillery...and mechs. Hell, what about hovercraft?


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_Cletus #35 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:21 PM

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View Postj_rod, on 13 February 2020 - 04:18 PM, said:


They might as well as artillery...and mechs. Hell, what about hovercraft?

 

I keep expecting to get the option to play that Omni corp robot that Robocop had to fight in the original.  


Dark_Magician_Girl, on 07 February 2020 - 08:59 PM, said:

Please show us on the doll where MM touched you

 

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RonaldusMaximus_ #36 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:37 PM

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ED-209

 


_Cletus #37 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:46 PM

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View PostRonaldusMaximus_, on 13 February 2020 - 04:37 PM, said:

ED-209

 

Yeah!  Although when you think about it, that thing would get decimated by missiles.  It's armor profile doesn't seem like it would bounce many shells either.


Dark_Magician_Girl, on 07 February 2020 - 08:59 PM, said:

Please show us on the doll where MM touched you

 

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RonaldusMaximus_ #38 Posted 13 February 2020 - 10:52 PM

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View Post_Cletus, on 13 February 2020 - 05:46 PM, said:

 

Yeah!  Although when you think about it, that thing would get decimated by missiles.  It's armor profile doesn't seem like it would bounce many shells either.

 

Not to mention its most notable weakness is its inability to navigate stairs.


 


RandomDeamon #39 Posted 13 February 2020 - 11:12 PM

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View PostMr_Qwertyxsad, on 29 January 2020 - 02:22 PM, said:

Best plan of action (against the T92E1 anyway) is to rush them the second they fire.  If you can rush them and they aren't supported by the rest of their team, that tank has sub 2k DPM in T9, so they are really not equiped to handle any form of brawling that isn't hit and fun.


Exactly. You push on them with medium tanks that have high DPM. I use my E 50 M to hunt them down all the time. A good ram and a few shots later. Problem solved. Most players won’t use missiles that effectively. I don’t even use them much only when I need to pen a heavy from the front because I’m pinned down or need to take them out. And I don’t use the look out bar. Tried that and while I can it’s not as effective. 



j_rod #40 Posted 14 February 2020 - 01:55 AM

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View PostRandomDeamon, on 13 February 2020 - 05:12 PM, said:


Exactly. You push on them with medium tanks that have high DPM. I use my E 50 M to hunt them down all the time. A good ram and a few shots later. Problem solved. Most players won’t use missiles that effectively. I don’t even use them much only when I need to pen a heavy from the front because I’m pinned down or need to take them out. And I don’t use the look out bar. Tried that and while I can it’s not as effective. 


Ah right. So when they’re sitting on the hill in Middleburg with two of their teammates supporting them, the solution is to rush them. Got it.

 

And bc you don’t/can’t use the missiles effectively, it’s not an issue. Also got it.

 

Great points. Thanks.


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