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What's up with that module target skin mod?

Mods hack cheating

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CptCheez #101 Posted 08 September 2015 - 08:25 PM

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View PostLephturn, on 08 September 2015 - 03:15 PM, said:

Forgive my programming n00bishness - but can't they just check-sum the skin files and exit the game immediately if they don't match? I'm sure there are much better ways than "check-sum" from a cryptography standpoint, but you get the idea.

 

There are many games and apps out there that will not even load if they detect the device is Jailbroken, games like Ingress.  That, of course, only applies to iDevices.  But then there are also Cydia (read: "jailbroken" ) tweaks that can be installed that prevent apps from detecting that.

 

I have no idea if any Android games do that or even if they can detect a rooted device.


Edited by CptCheez, 08 September 2015 - 08:26 PM.

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BRUENHILLDE #102 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:00 PM

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.View Postgogo_gadget_arms, on 08 September 2015 - 03:11 PM, said:

 

The guy in the post right above yours has a 70% WR and his Blitz is plain vanilla just like yours.

 

It's fair to say that everyone with a 70% or 80% WR takes the game seriously. And those that take the game seriously mitigate the issues you've discussed.  I've made some specific comments in the quote above. 

I don't know you nor do I care what your wr is. But I do care about cheaters and for you to critique down to a tee every one of my examples means to me that you have given much thought about being called out as a cheater. Well are you worried? 

 

 


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MSixteen #103 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:03 PM

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I like how people assume the mod is on my device 100% of the time.

 

Whether you guys think I'm feeding you [edited]or not (which y'all do), I know why and when I use it. Y'all don't.

 

And for those who are saying that I'm getting defensive because I know I'm wrong: I use it for my videos. It gives me little to no benefit when it is installed for my videos. If the mod auto aimed so you'd HIT the modules instead of just showing you where they are, it would be another matter entirely. I snapshot too much for the module locations to be effective anyways.

 

When WG comes out with a stance that is firmly against certain mods (which they are likely to do because of the stance the PC version has), I will no longer use the mods. Until then, Alo gave me the go-ahead, and I will continue to use the mod for my videos to help my viewers learn more. If you don't believe me... fine. If you don't like it, fine. But don't go calling me a 'cheat' because a mod is installed when I'm recording, which is NOT most of the time.


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furicle #104 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:13 PM

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View PostCptCheez, on 08 September 2015 - 03:25 PM, said:

 

There are many games and apps out there that will not even load if they detect the device is Jailbroken, games like Ingress.  That, of course, only applies to iDevices.  But then there are also Cydia (read: "jailbroken" ) tweaks that can be installed that prevent apps from detecting that.

 

I have no idea if any Android games do that or even if they can detect a rooted device.

 

I think not loading on jail-break devices would cause them more grief than it's worth.  I'd like to think there are lots of jailbreak folks who aren't interested in banned mods but would like to play the game.

 

And yes, I'd guess a plain check-summing would work fine, until they replace the module that's checking the check sums, or only changes the hit skins 30 seconds after the game loads, or... I'm talking through my hat here, of course.  I'm guessing if they make it difficult enough the first time combined with a firm public stance that might put the mods out of circulation for quite a while.

 

Actually, I wonder if usrbinperl has an opinion - he hasn't said much, but I suspect his IT skillset is much more aligned with this discussion than mine....


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tlouie #105 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:14 PM

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View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 05:03 PM, said:

I like how people assume the mod is on my device 100% of the time.

 

Whether you guys think I'm feeding you [edited]or not (which y'all do), I know why and when I use it. Y'all don't.

 

And for those who are saying that I'm getting defensive because I know I'm wrong: I use it for my videos. It gives me little to no benefit when it is installed for my videos. If the mod auto aimed so you'd HIT the modules instead of just showing you where they are, it would be another matter entirely. I snapshot too much for the module locations to be effective anyways.

 

When WG comes out with a stance that is firmly against certain mods (which they are likely to do because of the stance the PC version has), I will no longer use the mods. Until then, Alo gave me the go-ahead, and I will continue to use the mod for my videos to help my viewers learn more. If you don't believe me... fine. If you don't like it, fine. But don't go calling me a 'cheat' because a mod is installed when I'm recording, which is NOT most of the time.

 

I believe you when you say your use of the hitskin mod is for your viewers, because I suspect that you want your videos to be popular.  Who doesn't want a lot of subscribers and pageviews?  Why should people watch anyone else's channel when those channels don't have cheat mods installed.

 

Why again do the other popular channels not use hitskin mods?

 


Edited by tlouie, 08 September 2015 - 09:15 PM.


Lephturn #106 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:19 PM

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View PostCptCheez, on 08 September 2015 - 03:25 PM, said:

 

There are many games and apps out there that will not even load if they detect the device is Jailbroken, games like Ingress.  That, of course, only applies to iDevices.  But then there are also Cydia (read: "jailbroken" ) tweaks that can be installed that prevent apps from detecting that.

 

I have no idea if any Android games do that or even if they can detect a rooted device.

 

The "don't load if rooted" bit is probably a non-starter because of Android.  I'm thinking something in the app that contains a hash of the skins and compares that to what it should be and if it doesn't match it bails.

 

The cheat creators can get around most anything if motivated enough I'm sure - but raising the bar to make it more difficult to do will eliminate a large percentage of these mods. These guys update so frequently that if the re-salted and hashed each release it might take enough time for modders to work around it each time that it would make it not effective.

 

The mod architecture makes sense on PC - on mobile I think it should be a flat no to mods.


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CptCheez #107 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:21 PM

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View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 05:03 PM, said:

I like how people assume the mod is on my device 100% of the time.

 

Whether you guys think I'm feeding you [edited]or not (which y'all do), I know why and when I use it. Y'all don't.

 

Nobody assumed that.  You were straight up asked if you kept it on there when not recording, several times in fact, and you have yet to answer it.

 

Once these hit skin mods are installed, the game has to be completely removed from and then redownloaded & installed on an iPhone / iPad to get rid of them.  Or you can keep a backup copy of the original hit skins on your computer, in which case you still have to copy them back over onto the iDevice.  Either way, it's a giant hassle.  Are you saying that you do actually do that when playing and not recording?  And then you reinstall the mod only when recording?  If you do, then just say so and we'll have no reason to assume otherwise.


Edited by CptCheez, 08 September 2015 - 09:23 PM.

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gogo_gadget_arms #108 Posted 08 September 2015 - 10:36 PM

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View PostBRUENHILLDE, on 08 September 2015 - 09:00 PM, said:

I don't know you nor do I care what your wr is. But I do care about cheaters and for you to critique down to a tee every one of my examples means to me that you have given much thought about being called out as a cheater. Well are you worried? 

 

 

 

Okay dude.  Did you even read my first post?  I wrote a long post saying that this unfair advantage mod should be BANNED.

 

Then I took (or I now realize wasted) time to provide some advice to help you out with your multitude of problems.  I now realize that I could have said literally anything:

 

- "I am a cheater."

- "I am not a cheater."

- "I love lamp."

 

and you would have your same preconceived viewpoint.  You're right, you don't know me, and yet you believe I'm a cheater.  Hilarious.

 

This is straying from the original point, so that's all from me.



Rageburn #109 Posted 09 September 2015 - 05:21 PM

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People can argue about how it isnt cheating, and how the advantage wont make a difference with your average potato, but knowing exactly where to hit someone, every time, to get that ammo racking, to kill that driver, etc does make a big difference. Take a good player, for example. They're encountering a tank theyve never seen before, not unlike the battle of Cologne. There wont be magical paint on the hull of that unknown, however, an experienced tank commander will know angles, the penetration values of their own ammo, etc. Skill is what makes the difference. Skill is what makes you a good player, not cheating the system by proving you are inadecquate with the tools given.

 

The point is, using hit-skins and succeeding is no less of an achievement than seeing through eye holes of a blind fold. If you do use them, dont fool yourself. Youre as much of a loser as a 37% potato.

 

 


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Viper8757NC #110 Posted 09 September 2015 - 06:27 PM

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View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 09:03 PM, said:

I like how people assume the mod is on my device 100% of the time.

 

Whether you guys think I'm feeding you [edited]or not (which y'all do), I know why and when I use it. Y'all don't.

 

And for those who are saying that I'm getting defensive because I know I'm wrong: I use it for my videos. It gives me little to no benefit when it is installed for my videos. If the mod auto aimed so you'd HIT the modules instead of just showing you where they are, it would be another matter entirely. I snapshot too much for the module locations to be effective anyways.

 

When WG comes out with a stance that is firmly against certain mods (which they are likely to do because of the stance the PC version has), I will no longer use the mods. Until then, Alo gave me the go-ahead, and I will continue to use the mod for my videos to help my viewers learn more. If you don't believe me... fine. If you don't like it, fine. But don't go calling me a 'cheat' because a mod is installed when I'm recording, which is NOT most of the time.

Then why do you use it?

 

Really calls into question the practices of so-called ‘unicums,’ doesn’t it?


ps.  I just watched your T-54 video on YouTube (you’re welcome).  You used the hit skin to target and one-shot a Jagdpanther.  GIVE.ME.A.BREAK.



curtburrito #111 Posted 09 September 2015 - 06:38 PM

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This discussion has been amazing.  The first time I even heard about the hit skin mod was on one of Bushka's videos and it seemed interesting but sketchy at the same time.  I thought it was cool of him to denounce it and let everyone know he has stopped using it.  I don't think anyone can argue that this mod doesn't give you an unfair advantage, so if War Gaming has yet to define it really doesn't matter.  You know it gives you an unfair advantage, you know you are using it for that specific purpose, there really is no other reason.  The fact that you need War Gaming to define it for you just tells me that you lack moral character.  What amazes me is that none of us are getting rich off this game, we play because we enjoy the history, the competition, and even the camaraderie.  So why do anything that would tarnish this by using a hit skin mod?  The moment we all know you are using it then everything you have done in the game becomes suspect.  You lost your reputation, any level of respect, and honestly is that worth it?  To the guys who use it, if this is what you need to feel good about yourself then that says a lot about the kind of man, or lack there of you are.



 


 

 


curtburrito #112 Posted 09 September 2015 - 06:55 PM

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View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 04:03 PM, said:

I like how people assume the mod is on my device 100% of the time.

 

Whether you guys think I'm feeding you [edited]or not (which y'all do), I know why and when I use it. Y'all don't.

 

And for those who are saying that I'm getting defensive because I know I'm wrong: I use it for my videos. It gives me little to no benefit when it is installed for my videos. If the mod auto aimed so you'd HIT the modules instead of just showing you where they are, it would be another matter entirely. I snapshot too much for the module locations to be effective anyways.

 

When WG comes out with a stance that is firmly against certain mods (which they are likely to do because of the stance the PC version has), I will no longer use the mods. Until then, Alo gave me the go-ahead, and I will continue to use the mod for my videos to help my viewers learn more. If you don't believe me... fine. If you don't like it, fine. But don't go calling me a 'cheat' because a mod is installed when I'm recording, which is NOT most of the time.

 

 

It is disturbing that you need War Gaming to define to you what cheating is.  You knew that they made it against the rules in the PC version, you are fully aware of the advantage that it gives a player and yet you still not only continue to use it but openly advocate for others to use it.  When you typed that message to War Gaming it was in an effort to relieve you of some level of ethical responsibility.  The fact that Alo8 informed you that they haven't taken a stance on it changes nothing.  If you cannot see that you are destroying your reputation here along with any credibility then I am not sure what else there is to say to you.  I hope that someday you develop a moral compass of your own.



 


 

 


anonym_fgjJcN98D0iQ #113 Posted 09 September 2015 - 07:00 PM

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Mods should be BANNED.  And Rules should be enforced.  My opinion.  A level playing field seems the best reason.  This sums it up...

 

View PostBR1XT0N, on 07 September 2015 - 07:45 PM, said:

What I'd like to see happen is for WG to take a position on it and then actually enforce whatever decision they make. 

 

By the way BR1XT0N, does the Abrams ballistic fire-control computer use hit-skins?



ahredstealth #114 Posted 09 September 2015 - 07:18 PM

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Every year in Formula 1 some engineer(s) finds a new way to do something that some people deem out of the rules, and some people claim is just fine.

 

Until the ruling body states "This is allowed" they are allowed to continue running their car.

 

It's up to the rest of the field to implement it, or find a way to counter it until an official ruling is made.  The hit skins are available to everyone.  It's not like only 10% of the player base can use it.  Everyone can download it, and put it on if they want.  If you're going to claim stuff about jail breaking and how you can't/won't do it, that's still on you.

 

I also don't think taking away hit skins will make M16 less of a player.  His other skills are developed.  He doesn't over-expose.  He knows the maps.  If a person thinks the difference between a 37% player and a 70% player is hit skins, I don't think any more conversation is warranted with that person because they're not going to be listening to reason.

 

The real problem here to me is that the ruling body (Wargaming) is silent on an issue they know exists, and have already set precedent on in their other game.  If like Cheese said, we expect WG'ing to say this is not allowed, then just come out and say it!  Even if you don't have an answer to detect and boot yet the cheaters yet, just saying it's illegal will keep honest players from using it, and also wipe it off youtube because of reporting.

 

Or, maybe we should all get our pitch forks and torches and go kill Tom Brady.  A Super-unicum quarter back would have had to know he was cheating, right?  OMG ADVANTAGE! HE IS WORSE THEN A HIGH SCHOOL QUARTERBACK BECAUSE HE CHEATED!  KILL HIM!  KILL HIM!!!11!!!!

 

Either way, this last page has needed a heck of a lot more "simmer down."  It's a good conversation.  Don't ruin it with flame wars and personal call outs.


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Flibbidy_dibbidy #115 Posted 09 September 2015 - 08:31 PM

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Good read. My two cents. Msixteen is a cheater. A great player but a cheater. Anyone else that used a mod on the game is the same. Just call it what it is. The reason its most likely allowed to continue is that he pulls in thousands of views on utube which in turn puts cash in WG's pocket. You can be proud of your WR, but know that most folks now think your a fake...or at least need an aid of some sort to keep your 'elite' status, which totally tarnishes your acomplishment.

My analogy .......steroids in baseball......folks still try to agrue that you need the skill to hit the ball regardless of wether u juice or not. There will always be something in the back of folks mind............does this help? Does it not? 

You will from now on have a stigma associated with your WR and overall accomplishments due to your cheating.  Good luck with that.........



gogo_gadget_arms #116 Posted 09 September 2015 - 10:01 PM

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View Postahredstealth, on 09 September 2015 - 07:18 PM, said:

If a person thinks the difference between a 37% player and a 70% player is hit skins...

 

Nobody said that.  You're twisting someone's words to create a straw-man.

 

A unicum-level player is going to be a unicum-level player with or without the module skins.  In fact, I would go so far as to say if someone has four years of PC experience and they are a unicum-level player in Blitz, you could even disadvantage them by somehow taking away their built-in red pen skins and they would still be a unicum-level player.

 

But at the margin, all these things make a difference, maybe a couple games out of 100.



66_75_63_6b_20_79_6f_75 #117 Posted 09 September 2015 - 11:14 PM

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View PostViper8757NC, on 09 September 2015 - 12:27 PM, said:

Then why do you use it?

 

Really calls into question the practices of so-called ‘unicums,’ doesn’t it?


ps.  I just watched your T-54 video on YouTube (you’re welcome).  You used the hit skin to target and one-shot a Jagdpanther.  GIVE.ME.A.BREAK.

To this^

Per my stats I'm a Unicom. I'd beat you 10/10. I'd even let you go Teir X vs me Teir VIII. Not because of any hit skin because I'm far superior to you. Assuming all unicoms are in question because one players uses hit skin is a joke.

I'd aim my first shot at your tinfoil hat. 

Your broad brush, your rants, makes your argument null. 

To the Remainder:

Here's a question for all you dime store detectives:

If he believed he was cheating,

Why would he post it for all to see?

Why would he ask WG if it was ok? 

I just think it's because he is posting Videos on here and it competes with other CWG members. That

Seems to be the most obvious motivation. 

Face the fact without the hit skins this kid would walk over everyone posting on here, so what's your point?

 

 

 



PRIMO412 #118 Posted 10 September 2015 - 12:07 AM

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View PostRocket_NA, on 09 September 2015 - 06:14 PM, said:

To this^

Per my stats I'm a Unicom. I'd beat you 10/10. I'd even let you go Teir X vs me Teir VIII. Not because of any hit skin because I'm far superior to you. Assuming all unicoms are in question because one players uses hit skin is a joke.

I'd aim my first shot at your tinfoil hat. 

Your broad brush, your rants, makes your argument null. 

To the Remainder:

Here's a question for all you dime store detectives:

If he believed he was cheating,

Why would he post it for all to see?

Why would he ask WG if it was ok? 

I just think it's because he is posting Videos on here and it competes with other CWG members. That

Seems to be the most obvious motivation. 

Face the fact without the hit skins this kid would walk over everyone posting on here, so what's your point?

 

 

 

 

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Edited by DeadNinjaStorage, 10 September 2015 - 12:08 AM.


Parrott_Cannon #119 Posted 10 September 2015 - 01:18 AM

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yView PostRocket_NA, on 09 September 2015 - 07:14 PM, said:

To this^

Per my stats I'm a Unicom. I'd beat you 10/10. I'd even let you go Teir X vs me Teir VIII. Not because of any hit skin because I'm far superior to you. Assuming all unicoms are in question because one players uses hit skin is a joke.

I'd aim my first shot at your tinfoil hat. 

Your broad brush, your rants, makes your argument null. 

To the Remainder:

Here's a question for all you dime store detectives:

If he believed he was cheating,

Why would he post it for all to see?

Why would he ask WG if it was ok? 

I just think it's because he is posting Videos on here and it competes with other CWG members. That

Seems to be the most obvious motivation. 

Face the fact without the hit skins this kid would walk over everyone posting on here, so what's your point?

 

 

 

Honestly,

I'm going to ignore pretty much that whole statement because of the obvious, which I am quite certain has been completely explained in full detail by many. It doesn't have really anything to do with MSixteen as much as it has to do with, this is not at app that, and pay attention to this" EVERYONE" can use. It's not about Wether or not it's going to make a difference in his gameplay in your opinion. It's about wether or not it's going to offer, even in the slightest bit, an edge in gameplay to anyone who's able to use this app over those who can not. That's the ticket there, there is nothing in Wargamings equipment garage, or purchases through gold that can offer this. It's ONLY available to those with certain devices which are able to run this app during gameplay. That in itself is why it's referred to a cheat

 

. As far a MSixteen's videos, it's basically free advertising for this app, and encouraging people to watch them, that's what they are going to see and think they need to replicate in order to preform as such in the video. That's the way human nature works.

I for one hope that WG is looking at this carefully, and just hasn't made their final decision as of yet. 

 

 

 

 



_bel #120 Posted 10 September 2015 - 07:07 AM

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View PostRocket_NA, on 09 September 2015 - 11:14 PM, said:

To this^

Per my stats I'm a Unicom. I'd beat you 10/10. I'd even let you go Teir X vs me Teir VIII. Not because of any hit skin because I'm far superior to you. Assuming all unicoms are in question because one players uses hit skin is a joke.

I'd aim my first shot at your tinfoil hat. 

Your broad brush, your rants, makes your argument null. 

To the Remainder:

Here's a question for all you dime store detectives:

If he believed he was cheating,

Why would he post it for all to see?

Why would he ask WG if it was ok? 

I just think it's because he is posting Videos on here and it competes with other CWG members. That

Seems to be the most obvious motivation. 

Face the fact without the hit skins this kid would walk over everyone posting on here, so what's your point?

 

 

 

Haha:teethhappy::teethhappy: You're so far up your own [edited] you've become delusional. The funny thing is your not even that good, your a good tanker but to me your just average, nothing special. And your not beating anyone 10/10 in a tank two tiers under, gimme a break:facepalm: Yes it's not considered cheating now we get that.. Soon wg is gonna set some rules for it.


Edited by _bel, 10 September 2015 - 07:09 AM.

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