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What's up with that module target skin mod?

Mods hack cheating

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PlayWingsofDuty #81 Posted 08 September 2015 - 03:19 AM

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I'd like to be able to remove the coloring/not coloring for PEN, that is all i want. i'll take my chances, and switch it back on if i start sucking worse. is this possible?

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mehliveat #82 Posted 08 September 2015 - 04:09 AM

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View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

it's interesting that you're back peddling from the argument you made, even if it is 'hypothetical' after i told you how foolish it is.

 

and if the tracks were covered, and no obvious weak spots were shown, why the hell would you take a shot, and how would you have a shot at a crew or module if you couldn't pen?

 

Where am I back peddling exactly?

 

Summing up my comments so far in this thread.

 

 

Comment 2 was in response to your assertion,

 

View PostMSixteen, on 08 September 2015 - 09:11 AM, said:

 

if somebody is using the mod to deliberately take CAREFUL aim at your modules/crew then it will be easier for YOU to kill them, because they will take longer to aim for the module/crew that can be penetrated with the already existing hitskin ingame. the longer they are aiming at you, the easier it is for you to put a shot in to them and pull back.

 

Which I believe would only apply to noobs, and not a average/good player.  For example, if you are in a flanking medium and got to the side of a distracted IS6, I am pretty sure you will have plenty of time to move the reticle slightly to the left instead of the center of tank/side to hit the fuel tanks.

 

 

As to unicums, the benefits will still be there.  But it will be marginal and nothing too dramatic since most is already committed to memory, but some visual guides here and there will still help the decision process.

 

As to its impact on WRs, I don't think it will be as big as some numbers seen in this thread, but maybe a couple percent for the average/good players, less for the top guys.


Edited by mehliveat, 08 September 2015 - 04:12 AM.


koop123 #83 Posted 08 September 2015 - 05:56 AM

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Msixteen, why the heat? You seem like a level headed player, pretty chill person. . .so some people disagree with you. So what? My wife just laughed at me when she asked what I was doing, I had to hold in the rage and let her know we are discussing a vital issue here and would she please let me get back to caring about my, "little ipad tank game."

 

 

"if somebody is using the mod to deliberately take CAREFUL aim at your modules/crew then it will be easier for YOU to kill them, because they will take longer to aim for the module/crew that can be penetrated with the already existing hitskin ingame. the longer they are aiming at you, the easier it is for you to put a shot in to them and pull back."

 

I am fine with losing to a player who killed me because of skill. I have a hard enough time trying to manage my health pool then losing points--or having my driver killed and having to use a consumable to someone who only damaged me because of the mod. Those players are easily killed. The in game hit skin never said HERE, LOOK!!SHOOT HERE AND KILL HIS DRIVER OR HERE!!! HERE WE MADE A COOL FIRE SYMBOL SO YOU KNOW.....YOU CAN NOW SET HIS ENGINE ON FIRE!!!  But now I have damage I would not have had because of the mod. Maybe damage that handicaps my tank and that makes me an easy kill for a skilled player. Perhaps a player with your skill level does not understand someone like me--but you say you are trying to help. If someone is at a lower skill level, some things may be more difficult to overcome--things that would not be a big deal to someone on an expert level. Your fingertips hurt when you learn guitar, but over time you build up a callus and can play for hours. That alone stops many from learning guitar. Many people have a hard time drawing what they see, a skilled draftsman does it without thinking. In order to help them, you have to recall what it was like when you were in their shoes. Perhaps--maybe not--you can see why this would bother many of us?

 

If you are someone that wants to teach your viewers, realize that many of us are your viewers. Many of us are trying to get better, chalk this up to one more challenge to add to the list.

 

Now, I have two things to knock out before I cry myself to sleep on my tebra fanboy pillow.

 

1: Explain to the wife that this is not some stupid ipad tank game, it is fluid,point-of-view, team chess--would she mock the game of Magnus Carlsen?

2: I need to download this game I keep hearing about. . .Candy Crush? I have been told many times in chat I should go back to playing it, now that I hear they don't have mods--app store here I come!!!


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PRIMO412 #84 Posted 08 September 2015 - 06:16 AM

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you will see in life that doing what you want within your community regardless of your peers objections will yeild you very little reward. 

Edited by DeadNinjaStorage, 08 September 2015 - 06:32 AM.


tlouie #85 Posted 08 September 2015 - 09:21 AM

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View PostDeadNinjaStorage, on 08 September 2015 - 02:16 AM, said:

you will see in life that doing what you want within your community regardless of your peers objections will yeild you very little reward. 

 

DeadNinjaStorage nailed it perfectly.

 

The forum scorns obvious efforts to beat up on unskilled players for the sake of raising one's stats: Stat padding via seal clubbing.  Because the community knows it's wrong to do so. There is no honor in abusing the less skilled to inflate one's ego. And the forum doesn't need WG to make a rule about it. We just know we shouldn't.

 

Same thing here. It's cheating to use a hitskin mod. It's harmful to the community to flaunt its use. We know we shouldn't even without an explicit rule saying we can't.

 


Edited by tlouie, 08 September 2015 - 12:33 PM.


Val_Darrant #86 Posted 08 September 2015 - 10:15 AM

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The reason M16 is heated up is he knows he is wrong.

A confident person would continue his/her argument and not get so obviously defensive and fired up

 

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genegx #87 Posted 08 September 2015 - 12:17 PM

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I don't see how WG can continue to have a stance on mods that essentially just ignores the issue, because it creates a problem where one platform- Android- has an advantage over iOS. 

 

A lot of us use our iPad and/or iPhone for other purposes as well, and there is no way I am going to install a jailbreak written by a Chinese hacking team on a device containing other critical information. I'm running iOS 9 beta in any event, and RTM of iOS 9 will likely be out at the end of this week, and there is currently no jailbreak for iOS 9, so couldn't run this mod if I wanted too at this point. It's also much easier to install mods on Android, so if this mod continues to be allowed I will go get an Android tablet solely to play Blitz on in order to be on a level playing field with others using this really obvious CHEAT. 

 

As shown in the post with the hit skin on the IS-6, you know immediately where to aim to hit the ammo rack or the fuel tanks. Then after playing many games with this mod, of course you will remember these locations and not really need the mod then. Still a lot easier to have "hit me here" signs painted on every tank than jump over to Armor Inspector after every game and try to memorize from there. Really guys, do you need your little kid training wheels mod just for "educational purposes"? Hello??? you actually expect ANYONE to believe this?

 

And, the argument that using this mod is detrimental because those using it will take longer to aim giving the other guy the advantage is laughable and ludicrous. Not everyone here just fell off the turnip truck.



Lokeen #88 Posted 08 September 2015 - 01:05 PM

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I'll admit my initial reaction was heated and I'll admit that I'll probably keep playing the game but two facts remain for me.

 

 

It's an advantage not available in the standard version of the game.  It's also not available to everyone equally.

 

1. IT'S A CHEAT, plain and simple.

2. IMO Wargaming's "stance" on it thus far is GARBAGE.  The company enforces integrity in the game in other ares via the EULA.  Why be so whishy-washy with this issue?  Grow a set and protect the investment of those that are NOT happy with an unfair advantage given to some and not all!

 



gogo_gadget_arms #89 Posted 08 September 2015 - 02:22 PM

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Thanks to WriterDude for raising this topic.  I'll go on the record as saying module skins should be banned.

 

To anyone trying to defend this, let's do a little thought experiment.  WG could have included module skins in the game from the beginning, just like the red hit skins.  If they had, I guarantee you that my average damage PER SHOT would be higher.  That's because after playing for over a year, I generally know when to snapshot at center mass, and when I have time to leisurely and precisely aim.  My damage on the latter shots would be higher if I could smack modules nearly every time rather than making semi-educated guesses.  I won't speculate on average damage per game, or win rate, because in this thought experiment, everyone has the module skins.

 

Now coming back to reality, it is easy to see why this is an advantage that should not be selectively available.  One of the reasons why I began spending money on this game was, interestingly enough, that I respected the fact that the game was designed so you don't HAVE to spend money.  I only have one advantage (100% crews) over someone with no money but some patience -- they can shoot prammo, they can accrue free xp to avoid grinding stock tanks, etc.  I liked the egalitarianism which is now being eroded by an external advantage.

 

Finally, to those opposed to the module skins, please stop saying 'I'm 100% sure I'm taking more module damage after this mod came out', as you're undermining the credibility of our side of the argument.  You're not 100% sure.  There are at least two module skins, they probably came out at different times, and their adoption is gradual.  There are a number of biases, as well as factors like running different tanks over time, that render this statement meaningless.



BRUENHILLDE #90 Posted 08 September 2015 - 02:35 PM

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Sure there are great players. But do you really think 70% wr or 80% wr are legit without some sort or edge? Pro ball teams rarely win 7 or 8 out of 10. Just think about how many times your games have been interrupted. By a phone call or text. Dropped wifi. Distractions. Battery dead. Bad teams. Multitudes of other things. The law of averages usually applies to everybody. Doesn't it? Except maybe not those guys who use the mods. Hmmm. 

 

Edit: spelled legit wrong. I need a spelling mod. 


Edited by BRUENHILLDE, 08 September 2015 - 02:45 PM.

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furicle #91 Posted 08 September 2015 - 02:39 PM

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First up - yes it's cheating.

 

I'm curious why people think WG is being wishy washy.  It will cost them money now and on-going to start the arms race of making these skins hard to implement.   I just don't think they've received enough negative feedback yet to start that programming effort.  We need to make it clear it should be a priority.

 

This thread is likely a good start.


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tlouie #92 Posted 08 September 2015 - 02:50 PM

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View Postfuricle, on 08 September 2015 - 10:39 AM, said:

 We need to make it clear it should be a priority.

 

This thread is likely a good start.

 

I agree.  Here's the link to create a support ticket:

 

https://na.wargaming.../Tickets/Submit

 

And here below if the ticket text I sent them today.

 

Recently, the topic of hitskin mods has become heated. 

http://forum.wotblit...in-mod/#topmost

I have made many in app purchases with real money, but I will be reluctant to do so again in the future if WG doesn't make it a priority to ensure that we all play with a level playfield. I don't want to be left at a disadvantage solely because I choose not to use a hitskin mod exploit.

Please consider banning mod use, and enforcing a level and enjoyable playfield for all.

Thank you.



Val_Darrant #93 Posted 08 September 2015 - 03:36 PM

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Its interesting as I posted on twitter my dismay at this poor decision making by WG allowing these mod cheats.  Would you believe the response has been radio silence?  When I have posted dissatisfaction with other companies who extoll their use of social media I have gotten at least a request for more information by now...

 

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ahredstealth #94 Posted 08 September 2015 - 04:28 PM

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View PostBR1XT0N, on 07 September 2015 - 01:45 PM, said:

What I'd like to see happen is for WG to take a position on it and then actually enforce whatever decision they make.

I would also like to see this.  Not a PM, but an official Post.

View PostDelta256, on 07 September 2015 - 03:50 PM, said:

Although I would like to think otherwise, try typing "world of tanks blitz" into your search bar in Safari/preferred browser. The search terms that pop up aren't encouraging. Hacks and whatnot, if they continue to be unmoderated, will have a negative impact on the community and the game. It will only be a matter of time until someone implements a free cam hack, allowing you to see anywhere on the map, for example.

If you google World of Tanks Blitz Hacks you come up with all sorts of stuff that doesn't actually work.  Like the infinite gold hack.  "Just download this virus, send us your user name and password and we'll get the gold hack loaded onto your game."  Granted, some of them actually work, but you can't really go strictly by Google searches of WOTB hacks.

View Postglass2707, on 07 September 2015 - 06:57 PM, said:

I don't really think that this sort of thing is wide spread and I also don't see this particular mod being a significant advantage, though possibly a marginal one.  Good players are more worried about being in the right position to avoid shots, from enemies seen and unseen, than lining up shots on specific modules.  Hitting a spot where a module is only gives something like a 30% chance to do damage to it (except tracks) if my understanding is correct.

I agree that I don't think it is that widespread.  I played all weekend, and I had far more issues with swamp flankers then module damage on every hit.  I also agree that good players tend to do damage without taking any in return, and that has less to do with modules, and more to do with not over exposing yourself.

View Postfuricle, on 08 September 2015 - 08:39 AM, said:

First up - yes it's cheating.

 

I'm curious why people think WG is being wishy washy.  It will cost them money now and on-going to start the arms race of making these skins hard to implement.   I just don't think they've received enough negative feedback yet to start that programming effort.  We need to make it clear it should be a priority.

 

This thread is likely a good start.

I guess I never really thought about some of this.  It may cost WG'ing money in the form of programmers to constantly fight these hit skins (and other hacks), which could be a reason why they just feel at this point in time it's not worth tackling.

 

 

Yes, I agree it's cheating.  I don't use it mainly because I'm not jailbroke, and I'm to dumb to install mods.  Sometime I struggle with new updates because I'm busy resetting the clock on my VCR again.  I also would really like WG'ing to just come out and say, "Hey, this is illegal.  If you're caught, we'll ban you.  It disappoints me that they told M16 "It's all good.  Whatever."  Not enough to play a different game, but if this is the gate way cheat, and it turns into invisible tanks that can hide in buildings, this game will get dropped pretty quick.

 

Whatever the case, I think the discussion in this thread is pretty neat, as opposed to seven pages of nerd raging flame war, even though we have varying opinions.


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CptCheez #95 Posted 08 September 2015 - 04:58 PM

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View Postahredstealth, on 08 September 2015 - 12:28 PM, said:

Yes, I agree it's cheating.  I don't use it mainly because I'm not jailbroke, and I'm to dumb to install mods.  Sometime I struggle with new updates because I'm busy resetting the clock on my VCR again.  I also would really like WG'ing to just come out and say, "Hey, this is illegal.  If you're caught, we'll ban you.  It disappoints me that they told M16 "It's all good.  Whatever."  Not enough to play a different game, but if this is the gate way cheat, and it turns into invisible tanks that can hide in buildings, this game will get dropped pretty quick.

 

From what I recall reading in this thread, and I'm not going to go back through the whole thing, pretty much everyone agrees that it's cheating and/or gives an unfair advantage.  Everyone, that is, except MSixteen, who continues with his line of "It's not for ME guys, it's for my VIEWERS!".  And I'm pretty sure everyone (including him) knows that's B.S.  If it were just for his viewers, he'd remove it when he's not recording video.

 

I didn't read WG's response the same way you did, though, ahred.  To me it said, "We're discussing this internally, but have not yet come to a decision we are prepared to announce publicly.  So for now, we won't ban you, but that will probably change in the future."


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ahredstealth #96 Posted 08 September 2015 - 06:24 PM

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View PostCptCheez, on 08 September 2015 - 10:58 AM, said:

I didn't read WG's response the same way you did, though, ahred.  To me it said, "We're discussing this internally, but have not yet come to a decision we are prepared to announce publicly.  So for now, we won't ban you, but that will probably change in the future."

 

I definitely did not get the same "For now we won't ban you, but that will probably change in the future." vibe you did.  If fact they specifically said players using this mod will not be banned right now, and that they were looking at and discussing all the various Mods.  In my book that kind of equates to "Meh, whatever."  At least right now.

 

 

Also, is it just me, or are these "Hit Skin" icons hard to make out?  On my screen it just looks like white smeared on certain places on tanks the Youtube videos.  Maybe it's the lower resolution on the Youtube videos?  I doubt it would be that useful on my itty-bitty Non-uber-because-its-not-Apple phone.


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CptCheez #97 Posted 08 September 2015 - 06:29 PM

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View Postahredstealth, on 08 September 2015 - 02:24 PM, said:

I definitely did not get the same "For now we won't ban you, but that will probably change in the future." vibe you did.  If fact they specifically said players using this mod will not be banned right now, and that they were looking at and discussing all the various Mods.  In my book that kind of equates to "Meh, whatever."  At least right now.

 

Right now, yes, because the decision hasn't been officially made whether to ban these mods or not.  But they ARE banned on PC, which means WG already has a precedent set with that game.  I expect them to follow that with Blitz.

 

For them to enact a completely different and opposite rule for Blitz than they have on PC wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.


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Lephturn #98 Posted 08 September 2015 - 07:15 PM

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Forgive my programming n00bishness - but can't they just check-sum the skin files and exit the game immediately if they don't match? I'm sure there are much better ways than "check-sum" from a cryptography standpoint, but you get the idea.

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ahredstealth #99 Posted 08 September 2015 - 07:35 PM

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View PostCptCheez, on 08 September 2015 - 12:29 PM, said:

 

Right now, yes, because the decision hasn't been officially made whether to ban these mods or not.  But they ARE banned on PC, which means WG already has a precedent set with that game.  I expect them to follow that with Blitz.

 

For them to enact a completely different and opposite rule for Blitz than they have on PC wouldn't make a whole lot of sense.

 

I expect them to ignore it until it becomes a bigger problem.  :Shrug:  either way I don't think it's over effecting me at this point in time.

 

 

I wonder if they can track the module damage of the new British TDs versus the rest of the tanks Module damage  over the first week or something.  I'm assuming the hit skins won't work for the new tanks until someone goes and creates them right?  That's got to take some amount of time, right?

 

The module damage ratio between new tanks and old tanks may give them a clue on how prevalent the problem actually is.  Maybe.  I dunno.  Typing out loud here.  Sometimes my babbling helps, other times it doesn't.  I doubt it's something the player base can track, correct?


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gogo_gadget_arms #100 Posted 08 September 2015 - 08:11 PM

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View PostBRUENHILLDE, on 08 September 2015 - 02:35 PM, said:

Sure there are great players. But do you really think 70% wr or 80% wr are legit without some sort or edge? Pro ball teams rarely win 7 or 8 out of 10. Just think about how many times your games have been interrupted.

 

By a phone call or text. - Use a device that cannot be interrupted while playing.

Dropped wifi. - Use cell data as a backup if in mid-game; more importantly, have the discipline to not start playing or keep playing if you have bad ping.

Distractions. - Have discipline to not start playing if you are likely to be distracted.  An unexpected distraction every 1000 games doesn't move your WR.

Battery dead. - Plug in at 10% warning.  If you can't plug in, stop at 5% warning.

Bad teams. - Platoon.

Multitudes of other things. - Nah.  Don't imply that everyone with a 70 or 80 WR is a cheater.

 

The law of averages usually applies to everybody. Doesn't it? Except maybe not those guys who use the mods. Hmmm. 

 

The guy in the post right above yours has a 70% WR and his Blitz is plain vanilla just like yours.

 

It's fair to say that everyone with a 70% or 80% WR takes the game seriously. And those that take the game seriously mitigate the issues you've discussed.  I've made some specific comments in the quote above.







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