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Mediums are Being Nerfed - Supertested on January 4


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mehliveat #201 Posted 03 January 2017 - 10:42 PM

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Calm down.

 

They tested pen nerfs on PC as well, but it never went ahead.  But to give an idea of what nerfs look like

 

http://worldoftanks....changes/?page=1



Spekulatius #202 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:03 PM

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Delete

:child:


Edited by Spekulatius, 03 January 2017 - 11:17 PM.

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4sfield #203 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:12 PM

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  If the lunacy doesn't stop, this is what we're going to end up with.

 


 

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tcamp48 #204 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:16 PM

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View Post4sfield, on 03 January 2017 - 06:12 PM, said:

  If the lunacy doesn't stop, this is what we're going to end up with.

 

I started out with that. Atari 2600. A fond memory but wouldn't wanna go back. ;)



Howitzer_155 #205 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:33 PM

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View Posttcamp48, on 03 January 2017 - 06:16 PM, said:

I started out with that. Atari 2600. A fond memory but wouldn't wanna go back. ;)

you just brought me back to the 1980's with this pic.  ill bounce one of the wall on u.  lol



_Duncan_Idaho_ #206 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:41 PM

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I believe the premise for nerfing tier X meds is flawed. Deducing that a med is OP because the stats show that they do well may or may not consider a large number of factors which should be included in any conversation about nerfing something that folks may have paid actual $$ to obtain. As far as in game currency goes, getting a tier X tank is an expensive proposition. . . 

 

Here are factors, I believe play into the "appearance" that meds are OP.

 

1. Good players play meds in larger numbers.

2. MM is crazy sometimes. I see matches with all 50+ versus all sub 45 win rates. . . this means that if you are a good player that cares about your win rate, you might move to a heavy, or most likely to a med, where good performance can truly carry the game. It is very very difficult to carry in a TD (IMHO) and is only possible with a heavy if your opponents don't use prammo and your team creates an effective meat shield.

3. Most commonly, a win is determined by the mediums in the mix. If they do their job well, then the TD rain down damage and the heavies hold the line. If the meds are ineffective the game is lost (as a general rule, not always) Furthermore,  things that matter aren't necessarily stats. . . like who turned to face a flanking enemy, or who held down a critical position while everyone else got the damage and xp. there are so many ways in which one can play a critical role in this game without a mechanism for acknowledging those contributions that it seems like any data driven decisions would be inherently flawed without comprehensive analysis of actual gameplay.

 

Now, if WOT wants to get serious about fixing balancing issues in this game, buffing and nerfing tanks is not really what they need to do. good players can make do with whatever tanks are doing right now. What is broken is MM. Invest your balancing research in ensuring hat you don't pair up teams that look like the NBA playing in the olympic basketball team. . . you want balance, you have to find a way to balance players against eachother. Also, you need to balance the tank types on each team. Most of the time I get in one of my TDs, i find that I have 3-5 TDs on my team which is crazy. Teams should be balanced with no more than 3 of each type and no more than 2 TDs per team. . . and perhaps a minimum of 2 meds. .. . or maybe a maximum of 2 meds in order to prevent the wolf pack attacks that help to make the meds so dominant. I don't know cause I don't have the data, but I do know enough to know where the balance problem is. It is in MM, not in buffing and nerfing.

 

Then again, if what we all want is the occasional "o7" then maybe we don't want to fix MM. We want to win some, lose some but most importantly experience those extremely unbalanced games where we can wreak havoc on the battlefield. IMHO, while great for boosting my stats and trying out riskier techniques, those are not the games that are the most satisfying of games. I prefer the times where I barely win or lose in an epic dual only to find out I was fighting a unicom.

 

ON the specific tanks:

1. The fv has low pen in its prammo so nerfing its standard ammo is just absurd. . . it also has the weakest turret and gun mantlet armor imaginable which can be penned by just about anything on the battlefield with standard ammo.

 

2. the 54/62/140 - I only have the 54 but often hear that the 140 is the best tier X tank and have thus just researched it. . .  The turret has great armor but in order to use it, you have to play hull down, which doesn't always fit with what a medium needs to do. I destroy 140s on a regular basis with my E4 and fv215b. tier 9/10 russian mediums are the easiest tanks for me to rack.

 

I have 5 tier 10 tanks and find that I do just as well with my heavies and my one TD as I do with my two meds. IMHO, I don't need meds to be nerfed.

 


Edited by _Duncan_Idaho_, 04 January 2017 - 06:08 AM.

 

 


_LiLi_ #207 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:51 PM

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I like to come to the forums to educate myself, I also read a lot of the issues about the game.  I don't remember people complaining about all these mediums needing to be nerfed.  So my question is; why fix something that isn't broke?  I can't help but suspect there is another reason behind thsee actions...

_Duncan_Idaho_ #208 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:51 PM

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View PostAlucard8732, on 03 January 2017 - 10:15 PM, said:

 

47+ percent? Just below average because i was a noob earlier in my tanking Career? That return damage made a comeback in spades, and i am repairing my WR, instead of stat padding or rerollinh like some people i know. At the end of the day, stats dont mean squat. Ive seen nubs get lucky against a good team. RNGesus decides it all.

 

low WR may reflect not investing cash. not training crew to 100% can totally screw your win rate. Playing the Emil without the top gun gave me a sub 30% WR on that tank which is now being repaired with that epic top gun. . . . my point is WR is fun to track but doesn't reflect player ability accurately and it really isn't important anyway. If you want to point out that someone is not qualified in some way to participate in this conversation then maybe look at the number of games played and if it is below a certain amount, then maybe the don't have a valid voice, but really, chastising someone over a WR is just uncool. It is an obtuse unit of measurement. Let's keep the conversation on topic rather than lashing out at our fellow players. We only need to concern ourselves with their stats if we are recruiting them for a clan or tournament, not for participating in a forum conversation.

 

 


Player_39363936 #209 Posted 03 January 2017 - 11:57 PM

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View PostHowitzer_155, on 03 January 2017 - 09:45 PM, said:

did u even watch the twister cup finals?  grilles, is4's, is7's, stb1's were ALL used by the best players in the world not just russian mediums. im not raging im having a normal conversation about whats going on. 

 

 

Every game in the twister cup semi's and finals had 8-10 obj140.

 

 

That's just a fact.

 

 

It was embarrassing for the game.

 

 

And it was a dead giveaway of the fact of how OP the tank is.

 

 

I posted a thread immediatly saying it should be nerfed and got shouted down right away.

 

 

Guess I wasn't the only one who saw how ridiculous it was.

 



Njourour #210 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:02 AM

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RageNuke #211 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:10 AM

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Just tier 9 & 10 mediums being nerfed, huh? 

I'm back in action!


Player_39363936 #212 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:11 AM

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Just to clear it up for myself I went back and went through the video of the finals.

Game 1 ...  11 obj140.

Game 2 ... 9 obj140.

Game 3 ...  10 obj140.

Last game ... 6 obj 140.

 



Fumanchu_17 #213 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:15 AM

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 I love my 140 please don't nerf it 

RH_131 #214 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:21 AM

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So you're saying decreased Heat pen on tier 9 and X mediums......

 

 

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KimJongSpoon #215 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:27 AM

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Its not the guns that make mediums my favorite, its the mobility. If the E100 had a T62's gun, it wouldn't be as good as a T62. Here is just my input, but from the OP it seems like its not the player's opinions expressed on the forums that are going to affect this nerf, it's statistics from the supertest. 

 

1. Don't nerf the 4202's pen. That's literally its worst characteristic because it doesn't have HEAT.

2. Maybe consider that the players so use the supertest are not an accurate sampling of the players on the main server.

3. Maybe a tank isn't unbalanced because people are doing slightly higher than average in it. Maybe it's a fun tank to play, so a lot of good players play it. 

4. Medium tanks offer an inherently greater margin for demonstrations of player skill because of their mobility. A great player in an E100 can still get penned by someone shooting prammo, but a great player in a T-62 doesn't get penned because no one can shoot them. This means that a 75%er has a better chance of carrying the team against other not-incompetent players in a T-62 than an E100.

5. It is unclear what WG is trying to accomplish with nerfing the mediums. Yes, they might have a slightly higher WR, but the standard deviation of WR is probably much higher for mediums than for heavies. Even idiots can bounce every once in a while in an E100, but an idiot in a T-62 dies pretty quick.


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doomsday5674 #216 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:28 AM

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So you're saying that my Jägeru will finally be effective against teams of Russian or German mediums? Take that, speed demons!

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VikkoTheTusken #217 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:35 AM

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View Post4sfield, on 03 January 2017 - 06:12 PM, said:

  If the lunacy doesn't stop, this is what we're going to end up with.

 

 

This post wins the forums for the next month. I'm out of +1's too...:confused:

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wildbill_53_steel #218 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:37 AM

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Just got the t54 was going to get the 140,I earned the t54 for what it is ,working on getting the 140 for what it is.These tanks have been around for a long time and now you want to change them,doesn't seem fair I already own the 54 you should not be able to change something I already have. Been in those tier 9 /10 battles and the 54 have no real advantage.And most of the t54 battles are in tier 9/10  match ups,so talk about balance.  Humm

Zip_Zip #219 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:42 AM

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View PostVikkoTheTusken, on 03 January 2017 - 07:35 PM, said:

 

This post wins the forums for the next month. I'm out of +1's too...:confused:

Agreed, I took care of the +1


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VikkoTheTusken #220 Posted 04 January 2017 - 12:50 AM

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View PostZip_Zip, on 03 January 2017 - 07:42 PM, said:

Agreed, I took care of the +1

 

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