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COLLABORATION WITH WARHAMMER 40,000!


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WriterDude #181 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:10 PM

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View PostZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 08:46 AM, said:

 

Oh :) Give more anger! We would not do this if we did not know that most players like this. It should be understood that the forum is not all the players of the server

 

Salt from a mod? Now that's interesting. You're not being helpful here. 

 

You're also completely missing the point. I disagree with the premise that most of the players on the server are clamoring for fantasy tanks - over 20,000 battles, and I have never once, not even once, seen someone say in-game "wow, I wish I had more fantasy tanks to drive." 3600-odd forum posts, and I have seldom seen anyone here on the forums say "wow, you know what would make Blitz even more awesome? Fantasy tanks." 

 

No, most of the time people put up with fantasy tanks because they don't have a choice and because they don't want to sound like whiners. That's different from people liking them.

 

I'm not saying you're lying. I think your statement comes from somewhere - maybe you see better sales of the Lupus than the Cromwell B, or something. However, if we assume you're reporting on some surveys or metrics that we don't have, this is like saying that a popular choice is therefore a quality choice.

 

If you gauge food based on sales volume, you'd be putting McDonald's up for a Michelin Star. But nobody in their right mind believes that a billion McChokeburgers represent an overwhelming urge for fine dining. People eat at McD for convenience, ubiquity, cost, and consistency. The issue is NOT whether something is consumed frequently, or whether their customers are satisfied. They're eating junk food. They know they're eating junk food. If they weren't eating McDonalds, they'd be eating at Jack-in-the-Box or Burger King.

 

The issue is whether something represents quality. Fantasy tanks are junk food. Quality would be fixing the game, building new maps and better events, designing a better experience. If you can't see that, I can't help you here.


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__Crusader6__ #182 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:11 PM

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View PostLIGHTS___OUT, on 15 August 2017 - 11:47 AM, said:

 

Is this the same WG logic that brought us 3.8?
 

 

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SpartacusDiablo #183 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:15 PM

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View PostWriterDude, on 15 August 2017 - 12:10 PM, said:

 

The issue is whether something represents quality. Fantasy tanks are junk food. Quality would be fixing the game, building new maps and better events, designing a better experience. If you can't see that, I can't help you here.

I've come to the conclusion that they don't want our help. We are here to buy their tanks, say thank you, and that's it. Feedback (unless it's positive) is no longer wanted. 


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ZIoydd #184 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:17 PM

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View PostLIGHTS___OUT, on 15 August 2017 - 04:47 PM, said:

 

Is this the same WG logic that brought us 3.8?
 

 

Hey! We speak about fantasy tanks, not about game feature.

tankeatingtiger #185 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:23 PM

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So listen to us in the thousands of threads about game features then.


Edited by tankeatingtiger, 15 August 2017 - 05:26 PM.

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4sfield #186 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:24 PM

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View PostWriterDude, on 15 August 2017 - 12:10 PM, said:

 

Salt from a mod? Now that's interesting. You're not being helpful here. 

 

You're also completely missing the point. I disagree with the premise that most of the players on the server are clamoring for fantasy tanks - over 20,000 battles, and I have never once, not even once, seen someone say in-game "wow, I wish I had more fantasy tanks to drive." 3600-odd forum posts, and I have seldom seen anyone here on the forums say "wow, you know what would make Blitz even more awesome? Fantasy tanks." 

 

No, most of the time people put up with fantasy tanks because they don't have a choice and because they don't want to sound like whiners. That's different from people liking them.

 

I'm not saying you're lying. I think your statement comes from somewhere - maybe you see better sales of the Lupus than the Cromwell B, or something. However, if we assume you're reporting on some surveys or metrics that we don't have, this is like saying that a popular choice is therefore a quality choice.

 

If you gauge food based on sales volume, you'd be putting McDonald's up for a Michelin Star. But nobody in their right mind believes that a billion McChokeburgers represent an overwhelming urge for fine dining. People eat at McD for convenience, ubiquity, cost, and consistency. The issue is NOT whether something is consumed frequently, or whether their customers are satisfied. They're eating junk food. They know they're eating junk food. If they weren't eating McDonalds, they'd be eating at Jack-in-the-Box or Burger King.

 

The issue is whether something represents quality. Fantasy tanks are junk food. Quality would be fixing the game, building new maps and better events, designing a better experience. If you can't see that, I can't help you here.

 

  If that's true it's because they created it. An OP heavy in the current meta makes a premium heavy way more attractive than a tank with paper armor who's pen and pramo alpha has been nerfed.


Edited by 4sfield, 15 August 2017 - 05:25 PM.

 

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ZIoydd #187 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:27 PM

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I respect each of you and i respect your opinion. But Warhammer, Sega and other it's global cooperation, which very important for WG. 

 

You may be unhappy, but this will not change anything in this situation. 

 

Your opinion is still very important to me and when we speak about game feature, i collect your posts and discuss with our developer about your feedback.

 

early i collected feddb only on RU, but i can collect feedback from all regions now.



SpartacusDiablo #188 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:28 PM

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View Post4sfield, on 15 August 2017 - 12:24 PM, said:

 

  If that's true it's because they created it. An OP heavy in the current meta makes a premium heavy way more attractive than a tank with paper armor who's pen and pramo alpha has been nerfed.

Yup. Only a small group of players are going to make the Cromwell B work well for them in the current meta.  A premium, well armored heavy on the other hand is the perfect match for a large % of the current player base.


The very existence of flamethrowers proves that some time, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done." 

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SpartacusDiablo #189 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:36 PM

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View PostZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 12:27 PM, said:

I respect each of you and i respect your opinion. But Warhammer, Sega and other it's global cooperation, which very important for WG. 

 

You may be unhappy, but this will not change anything in this situation. 

 

Your opinion is still very important to me and when we speak about game feature, i collect your posts and discuss with our developer about your feedback.

 

early i collected feddb only on RU, but i can collect feedback from all regions now.

I'm really curious about this Zloydd.

 

How are modern tanks too advanced for blitz (balance issues with their guns and armor) and yet fantasy tanks from 40,000 years in the future are okay and will fit right into the current meta? 


The very existence of flamethrowers proves that some time, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done." 

George Carlin

Support your neighborhood scout

​#FixTheFury 


ZIoydd #190 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:44 PM

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View PostSpartacusDiablo, on 15 August 2017 - 05:36 PM, said:

I'm really curious about this Zloydd.

 

How are modern tanks too advanced for blitz (balance issues with their guns and armor) and yet fantasy tanks from 40,000 years in the future are okay and will fit right into the current meta? 

 

There is am important point. We can tune fantsy tanks so that they are equal to machines from other tanks. If we add modern tanks in Blitz - they will simple tanks with camo (skin).



WriterDude #191 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:47 PM

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View PostZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 10:27 AM, said:

I respect each of you and i respect your opinion. But Warhammer, Sega and other it's global cooperation, which very important for WG. 

 

You may be unhappy, but this will not change anything in this situation. 

 

Your opinion is still very important to me and when we speak about game feature, i collect your posts and discuss with our developer about your feedback.

 

early i collected feddb only on RU, but i can collect feedback from all regions now.

 

This is more helpful. Putting aside the idea that we were being ignored up until now, if you could take these observations and put them in front of the rest of the Wargaming team, and actually change things to reflect our insights, that would help us feel that we're being heard. 

 

Also, and this is critically important to understand, North America is not monolithic. I'd say it's more likely than not that we'll have extremely diverse opinions. I beg you not to pay attention to the most common opinion, and seek out the people who disagree, because they'll teach you more than the people who agree. The NA forum isn't the source of all wisdom, but if you pay attention to the talented players here who know the game better, you'll get better quality insights. I'm not talking specifically about me, or unicums, or super-unicums, or Blartch. I'm saying filter out anyone who wants to turn the game into "whooooooosh, bam, boom, kek." If you try to chase that market, the adults are going to leave, and you're going to fail.


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Herr__Dornstahl #192 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:48 PM

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Do any devs actually play this game? Just curious. 
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SpartacusDiablo #193 Posted 15 August 2017 - 05:48 PM

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View PostZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 12:44 PM, said:

 

There is am important point. We can tune fantsy tanks so that they are equal to machines from other tanks. If we add modern tanks in Blitz - they will simple tanks with camo (skin).

That is a whole lot of tuning and a fine line to walk. Good luck making these tanks fit within the current meta without disappointing the warhammer fans you are hoping to draw to the game. Seems like a double edged sword from where I'm sitting.


The very existence of flamethrowers proves that some time, somewhere, someone said to themselves, "You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I'm just not close enough to get the job done." 

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DrFerd #194 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:06 PM

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The developers need to realize they are sitting on a gold mine, not by bringing these tanks to Blitz, but by spinning out another variant of the game where anything goes. Anime, fantasy, mini-figure, board game, computer games etc etc. Thats where the sky's the limit and no-one will care about the "theme" of the ecosystem. In Blitz, despite what keeps being shoveled our way to define what it is that we must like, the introduction of these tanks is not insanely popular. 

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jahawa #195 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:09 PM

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View PostWriterDude, on 15 August 2017 - 11:10 AM, said:

 

Salt from a mod? Now that's interesting. You're not being helpful here. 

 

You're also completely missing the point. I disagree with the premise that most of the players on the server are clamoring for fantasy tanks - over 20,000 battles, and I have never once, not even once, seen someone say in-game "wow, I wish I had more fantasy tanks to drive." 3600-odd forum posts, and I have seldom seen anyone here on the forums say "wow, you know what would make Blitz even more awesome? Fantasy tanks." 

 

No, most of the time people put up with fantasy tanks because they don't have a choice and because they don't want to sound like whiners. That's different from people liking them.

 

I'm not saying you're lying. I think your statement comes from somewhere - maybe you see better sales of the Lupus than the Cromwell B, or something. However, if we assume you're reporting on some surveys or metrics that we don't have, this is like saying that a popular choice is therefore a quality choice.

 

If you gauge food based on sales volume, you'd be putting McDonald's up for a Michelin Star. But nobody in their right mind believes that a billion McChokeburgers represent an overwhelming urge for fine dining. People eat at McD for convenience, ubiquity, cost, and consistency. The issue is NOT whether something is consumed frequently, or whether their customers are satisfied. They're eating junk food. They know they're eating junk food. If they weren't eating McDonalds, they'd be eating at Jack-in-the-Box or Burger King.

 

The issue is whether something represents quality. Fantasy tanks are junk food. Quality would be fixing the game, building new maps and better events, designing a better experience. If you can't see that, I can't help you here.

 

Well said WriterDude!

Dark_Magician_Girl #196 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:19 PM

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I'll bet money WG staff goes town on middleburg.

WriterDude #197 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:23 PM

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View Postjahawa, on 15 August 2017 - 11:09 AM, said:

Well said WriterDude!

 

Thanks man. You know, what's funny is that I've been reading a ton of science fiction lately, and two books in a row talked about the Fermi Paradox. 

 

The Fermi Paradox is stated as a question, "with trillions of stars out there, there must be thousands of technological civilizations. If those civilizations developed, why haven't we been able to detect any of them, and why have't any of them contacted us yet?" Do we assume we're alone in the universe? If not, where is everybody?"

 

Wargaming's approach to development seems to be like the game developer's response to the Fermi Paradox. They built the game, and attracted the game community, and over time, you'd assume that more people would be drawn to the game. However, when they look at the player population, it's relatively static. Wouldn't you think it would grow and grow and grow and grow? Where is everybody? So they threw the GUP tanks out there. Valkyria Chronicles. Halloween tanks. Now Warhammer. What next, Hammer's Slammers hover tanks with laser main guns? The Bolo Mark XXX? (Or Ogre Mk V...)

 

I wonder if they're forgetting simple stuff, like the fact that they're alienating some of their player base with each progressive change. They need to always attract more players than they alienate. That's not happening. I don't blame them for fishing around for other player bases they can tap, but I can resent it when they finally alienate the people I love to play with and against, and the only choices I have left in game are whether I load up some bizarre-world fantasy tank and play against 40% twitch jockeys or go play something else.


Edited by WriterDude, 15 August 2017 - 06:25 PM.

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__Boomer2__ #198 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:36 PM

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View PostDrFerd, on 15 August 2017 - 01:06 PM, said:

The developers need to realize they are sitting on a gold mine, not by bringing these tanks to Blitz, but by spinning out another variant of the game where anything goes. Anime, fantasy, mini-figure, board game, computer games etc etc. Thats where the sky's the limit and no-one will care about the "theme" of the ecosystem. In Blitz, despite what keeps being shoveled our way to define what it is that we must like, the introduction of these tanks is not insanely popular. 

 

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slayer_____ #199 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:40 PM

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View PostZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 10:46 AM, said:

 

Oh :) Give more anger! We would not do this if we did not know that most players like this. It should be understood that the forum is not all the players of the server

 

if that's true from your perception then do an "in game" survey. WG has done surveys before, time for another. I think you'll be genuinely surprised with the results. If you'd like help with the questions to ask, I'll gladly assist. 

ElderMaxson #200 Posted 15 August 2017 - 06:56 PM

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View Post4sfield, on 15 August 2017 - 12:54 AM, said:

  I hate anime. I hate [edited] cartoon tanks and I hate the fact that it doesn't matter what anyone says. Resistance is futile, we're done here.

 

if you hate anime and cartoon tanks then you shouldn't have a problem with warhammer tanks lol.

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