271 replies to this topic

[little_brother_of_war]

ZIoydd, on 15 August 2017 - 09:46 AM, said:

 

Oh Give more anger! We would not do this if we did not know that most players like thisj. It should be understood that the forum is not all the players of the server

 

This is possibly the most revealing thought coming out of this entire excercise and something I have long suspected as being the case. The basic mechanics related to the modern day dance of social effectiveness when soliciting ones opinion is generally, a facade. This is often times true in the interactions between businesses and their revered  customer base when they solicit feedback such as "Please let us know what you think.",  "We want to hear from you.", "Tell us how we're doing!", so on and so forth, etc., etc.

 

We all may have experienced similar types of scenarios in different educational and workplace settings, when asked to provide suggestions, ideas and opinions from a supervisor, teacher or manager in order to help improve your own individual situation. 

 

But of course, at some point, the light bulb eventually goes off (insert light bulb meme here?) and an individual slowly begins to realize such openess and generosity is at times merely a ruse at providing cover for any potential incoming pushback and noted dissatisfaction from students, employees, customers (and player base members?) and to shield those in the dominant position from accountability.

 

This is usually made apparent when the individual(s) in charge fail to follow up or take action on the information requested and so, all opinions and such put forth, tend to fall off the map completely. Any way some old timers may remember the old suggestion box thing that used to be place in some establishments and businesses and how they were always full and never got emptied, much less suggestions read and/or acted upon. (...sorta like that?)

 

Its nothing new, actually. But here and now, the idea of what's occurring is just coming into reality more effectively, with more transparency and in its truly rawest form. It's an excercise in appearances and always has been, apparently. Now, in case it wasn't obvious enough before, everyone on every side should for certain know where they stand (or where they have no standing?).

 

This may be true for forum participants as well. WG is providing a format for feedback, social interaction and commentary, etc., and so it might be considered more as a complimentary aspect to its gaming systems and nothing more.

 

So, most of us might tend to understand the obvious even more so, when presented as a single statement in its most purest form such as here...and take it to heart. Perhaps we can learn from this when considering all future input to be weighted by this one line when composing a response, suggestion, idea or even more emphatically, complaints, gripes or other aspects of general discontent...

 

"It should be understood that the forum is not all the players of the server".

 

If nothing else, it seems our Russian counterparts are, at the very least, direct.

 

Knowledge is everything and, to know, is to be be aware. No false illusions here, my friends.

 

And isn't that what we all want in the end, and when it comes down to it, to know what is true and real, as it affects our own sense of place and importance? And to understand where we actually are (for better or worse), in the greater scheme of things, and ultimately, for all things Blitz...

 

 

peace

_lbow_

Edited by little_brother_of_war, 19 August 2017 - 04:54 PM.

[Lokeen]

You've got to be kidding me.......sigh......more garbage.......

[4sfield]

little_brother_of_war, on 19 August 2017 - 11:30 AM, said:

 

This is possibly the most revealing thought coming out of this entire excercise and something I have long suspected as being the case. The basic mechanics related to the modern day dance of social effectiveness when soliciting ones opinion is generally, a facade. This is often times true in the interactions between businesses and their revered  customer base when they solicit feedback such as "Please let us know what you think.",  "We want to hear from you.", "Tell us how we're doing!", so on and so forth, etc., etc.

 

We all may have experienced similar types of scenarios in different educational and workplace settings, when asked to provide suggestions, ideas and opinions from a supervisor, teacher or manager in order to help improve your own individual situation. 

 

But of course, at some point, the light bulb eventually goes off (insert light bulb meme here?) and an individual slowly begins to realize such openess and generosity is at times merely a ruse at providing cover for any potential incoming pushback and noted dissatisfaction from students, employees, customers (and player base members?) and to shield those in the dominant position from accountability.

 

This is usually made apparent when the individual(s) in charge fail to follow up or take action on the information requested and so, all opinions and such put forth, tend to fall off the map completely. Any way some old timers may remember the old suggestion box thing that used to be place in some establishments and businesses and how they were always full and never got emptied, much less suggestions read and/or acted upon. (...sorta like that?)

 

Its nothing new, actually. But here and now, the idea of what's occurring is just coming into reality more effectively, with more transparency and in its truly rawest form. It's an excercise in appearances and always has been, apparently. Now, in case it wasn't obvious enough before, everyone on every side should for certain know where they stand (or where they have no standing?).

 

This may be true for forum participants as well. WG is providing a format for feedback, social interaction and commentary, etc., and so it might be considered more as a complimentary aspect to its gaming systems and nothing more.

 

So, most of us might tend to understand the obvious even more so, when presented as a single statement in its most purest form such as here...and take it to heart. Perhaps we can learn from this when considering all future input to be weighted by this one line when composing a response, suggestion, idea or even more emphatically, complaints, gripes or other aspects of general discontent...

 

"It should be understood that the forum is not all the players of the server".

 

If nothing else, it seems our Russian counterparts are, at the very least, direct.

 

Knowledge is everything and, to know, is to be be aware. No false illusions here, my friends.

 

And isn't that what we all want in the end, and when it comes down to it, to know what is true and real, as it affects our own sense of place and importance? And to understand where we actually are (for better or worse), in the greater scheme of things, and ultimately, for all things Blitz...

 

 

peace

_lbow_

 

  I work at a Japanese auto manufacturing supplier company. We have still have a suggestion box, everything that goes in that box is responded to and investigated. There is even a "President's Box". Those are all responded to by him personally. We also have a monthly meeting where every associate is packed into the cafeteria on both shifts and everything that has happened for the previous month is reviewed and put out in front of the masses for all to see. 

 

  The point is EVERYTHING is investigated and issues are resolved. If there is no practical solution to an issue raised, A solid reason sometimes with data is given as to why we do things the way we do. 

 

  If we told everyone that their opinion didn't matter because they were just one person, we wouldn't have survived or continued to grow and expand as a Company over the last 17 years. If I displayed WG's attitude with my associates, I wouldn't get much out of them and they'd all be in admin writing statements about me. If I told them all to STFU and just do what I say because they're stupid and their opinion doesn't matter, I'd be looking for a job faster than this game is going down the toilet.

[reluctanttheist]

Wargaming is free to do whatever it thinks will overall benefit its bottom line.  As forum users, we account for a fraction of the money they make and an even smaller fraction of the user base.

 

If WG thinks a Warhammer collaboration makes sense, it merely makes it a bitter pill for the history enthusiasts that were drawn to the game, and those that became historical enthusiasts BECAUSE of the game.  I am in both camps - I knew a fair amount about tanks, but because of the game, have learned much more about armored vehicles because of Blitz.

 

Blitz and WoT have earned considerable respect for their attention to accuracy and details with their vehicles.  The fantasy tanks undermine this respect, and I would be very interested to know how these tanks contribute to WG's income, versus the revenue lost from players who lose interest in the game as a result of these changes.  As others have noted, these silly tanks tend to be used less as time goes on.  People buy these tanks and then play them less compared to the actual historical tanks.  Perhaps we can console ourselves that people might drop a few bucks buying a cartoon tank to help fund the game, play it a few times and then garage it.

Edited by reluctanttheist, 21 August 2017 - 02:19 PM.

[Carrier_Lexington]

Wow. Was not expecting so many people to be hating on 40k... Kinda makes me sad that people driving pixelated tanks around a tiny map and shooting things within an aiming circle and toting their little healthbars would be so hateful of anything "unhistorical."
 

It's sad, 'cause 40k has some really, really cool tanks. (In fact, I hope WoWS does a collab with Battlefleet Gothic, 'cause there's some pretty cool stuff there, too)

 

Imperial Guard:

The Imperial Guard has some of the best armored divisions in the galaxy. Almost all of their tanks are slow, heavily armored (in front), and have big ol' howitzers for guns. I'll focus on the one that would be easiest to put in Blitz.

Leman Russ (Heavy Tank): The Leman Russ is the Imperium's typical heavy tank. It has heavier frontal armor than any Space Marine tank bar the Landraider (but its sides and rear are made of soda cans), and can upgrade with a suite of weapons including Plasma cannons, a long-barreled Vanquisher cannon (read: Sherman Firefly), or the Demolisher cannon from a Baneblade. This is what you will most likely see out of a Blitz-40k Collaboration, along with the Predator (and possibly the Fire Prism), and you will most likely see it with the Vanquisher model, since that model seems to be directly taken from the Sherman Firefly concept.

 

Space Marines (Loyalist and Chaos):

Space Marines have a series of vehicles as well, mostly centered around being line-breakers that allow their heavy infantry to sweep-in and flank.

Predator (Medium Tank): The go-to tank for any Space Marine chapter, the Predator is a typical Medium tank (in 40k terms): it has a smaller yet faster-firing main cannon, it is quick and decently armored all-round, and is highly accurate. This is one of the tanks you will most likely see result out of a 40k collaboration.

 

Eldar:

Eldar vehicles focus on being fast and heavily armed at the expense of armor.

Fire Prism (Light Tank): A typical Light Tank/Tank Destroyer hybrid, the Fire Prism features a large crystal instead of a main gun that fires a tightly-focused laser which melts through armor and is pretty accurate and is mounted on a high-speed chassis. If you're relying on your armor to bounce shots, however, you're doing it wrong.

Edited by Carrier_Lexington, 21 September 2017 - 10:34 PM.

[Sgt_T_21]

I was drawn to this game because of the ability to drive tanks that I had models of as a kid. I've always been into wargaming in many forms: tabletop miniatures, board games, computer games.  I had huge armies of HO scale infantry (Airfix, anybody?) and tanks I scrounged together from any number of model makers. 

 

When the Tankenstein came on scene, I was into it. I thought it wa a cool idea and added variety. Because while I was drawn to the historical aspects of the game, I found that, at the end of the day, it was simply fun. I got into the idea that hey, these tanks never faced off vs each other in real life (think +2/-2 days) but I'm down. And anybody who has been around since the beginning certainly remembers the pinnacle of failtoons, the super troll Maus/MS-1 combo.  

 

I say say this because there has been a certain amount of "arcade" to this game from the start. I remember in my first game I took a shot at a green tank because it was German and I was in my T-1 (super noob!) but again, arcade. In real life, we have 7 tanks from any number of nations fighting 7 tanks from any number of nations. And that would be just counting tech and "real" premiums. So when I see the Van Helsing or the Edelweiss or the Lupus, does it ruin my game experience? No, not really. They are simply other tanks to deal with. 

 

That being said, do I wish there was an historical only mode? Absolutely. I would love to play that. But then I'd be just as happy switching back to my Nameless or my Tankenstein. Because it's fun for me. Because I've recognized that this game has moved in that direction for quite some time. Yes, I love the historical accuracy in the real tanks, and certainly appreciate that the game mechanics try to deal with how these tanks were made to a certain degree. But at the end of the day, it hasn't been the historical game a lot of people thought they were getting into. Which is a bummer in some ways, I can certainly recognize. But then, I think back to my battles with my soldiers I'd set up as a kid, where I had Russians and Americans with a Sherman, a T-34, and an IS-3 fighting Germans with a Marder, a STUG, a Panther, and a King Tiger.  And a couple space guys, cuz I had them and they were cool.

 

And that brings us to my long-winded point. I'm going to buy the Warhammer tank(s) because I played Warhammer and think it would be cool to have them in this game since I had them as models. Which is why I'll keep my IS-3 around even though I rarely play it (for now). Because I had it as a kid. And because at the end of the day, blowing up tanks is fun. 

 

o7. Happy Tanking. And have fun.

[reluctanttheist]

Good attitude Sgt!

[BobaFett_56]

_Sterben_, on 14 August 2017 - 05:12 PM, said:

Pfft yeah right,

another Premium Tank Collaboration, 

can't wait this OP Behemoths rigging the game 

 

Yes I am alreadying saving up a supply of Spare Parts. 

Anyone have any good pictures of what the tanks look like so we have some idea of what the in game ones will look like?

Edited by BobaFett_56, 22 September 2017 - 03:15 PM.

[Sgt_T_21]

reluctanttheist, on 22 September 2017 - 06:14 AM, said:

Good attitude Sgt!

 

thank you sir, and +1 for your willingness to read my lengthy post. 

[mastertanker28]

My god. Here is what you guys need to do (VERY IMPORTANT)

1. Stop putting in these fantasy tanks like bro what the heck we don't need fictional garbage like lupus or gundam tank

2. If you want to still make collabs with other game franchises why dont you at least make some tank based off actual tank designs give it a cool skin based off the collab game

3. When you plan to make a premium grind event like the missile event please at some actual game mechanics to balance the game    

 

[mike82198]

4sfield, on 19 August 2017 - 12:17 PM, said:

 

  I work at a Japanese auto manufacturing supplier company. We have still have a suggestion box, everything that goes in that box is responded to and investigated. There is even a "President's Box". Those are all responded to by him personally. We also have a monthly meeting where every associate is packed into the cafeteria on both shifts and everything that has happened for the previous month is reviewed and put out in front of the masses for all to see. 

 

  The point is EVERYTHING is investigated and issues are resolved. If there is no practical solution to an issue raised, A solid reason sometimes with data is given as to why we do things the way we do. 

 

  If we told everyone that their opinion didn't matter because they were just one person, we wouldn't have survived or continued to grow and expand as a Company over the last 17 years. If I displayed WG's attitude with my associates, I wouldn't get much out of them and they'd all be in admin writing statements about me. If I told them all to STFU and just do what I say because they're stupid and their opinion doesn't matter, I'd be looking for a job faster than this game is going down the toilet.

 

You're comparing your relationship with your employer as an employee with your relationship with wargaming as a customer. Why?

 

The valuable feedback you've given to WG on this thread's subject is your ownership of the Nameless, Edelweiss, Helsing, Dracula and O-47. I assure you and everyone here that WG would have long ago ceased with these colorful collaborations (and the oft derided events they're part of) if people did not buy into them. They're not in the business of wasting developer time on products that don't sell. 

 

---

 

I had no idea GuP, Valkyria Chronicles and Warhammer existed before their content was introduced in Blitz. I still don't know anything about them and I've not bought the corresponding premiums (I do have the GuP tanks since they were effectively a give away, but haven't played them much). I think the "historical" and aesthetic balance in the game is fine and that there are much more important areas for improvement than fictional tanks that are also a bit colorful and adhere to the same fictional arcade rules as a HESH spitting Death Star with a flaming yellow "camo". Lest we forget: T-34 tracks did not repair in 0.3 seconds while the tank was on fire in 1943. Blitz is not oriented toward historical buffs/purists. 

 

I'm not going to buy these tanks - unlike some of the critics who will - and doubt that they will add anything to my experience as a player. Nevertheless, I don't mind their existence in principle and hope that their introduction makes the Warhammer fans happy and keeps the lights on in Minsk (and Emeryville), because I generally enjoy Blitz as a lively game where I get to shoot pixel things. 

 

If you don't like these tanks - don't buy them. If you think they're significant setback for the game and stand for yet another step into the abyss  - don't buy anything. What signal does someone who says that the game is dying on the forums send to WG when he keeps on spending? The proof - and the truth - is in the dollar. 

Edited by mike82198, 23 September 2017 - 08:19 AM.

[4sfield]

mike82198, on 23 September 2017 - 03:07 AM, said:

 

You're comparing your relationship with your employer as an employee with your relationship with wargaming as a customer. Why?

 

The valuable feedback you've given to WG on this thread's subject is your ownership of the Nameless, Edelweiss, Helsing, Dracula and O-47. I assure you and everyone here that WG would have long ago ceased with these colorful collaborations (and the oft derided events they're part of) if people did not buy into them. They're not in the business of wasting developer time on products that don't sell. 

 

---

 

I had no idea GuP, Valkyria Chronicles and Warhammer existed before their content was introduced in Blitz. I still don't know anything about them and I've not bought the corresponding premiums (I do have the GuP tanks since they were effectively a give away, but haven't played them much). I think the "historical" and aesthetic balance in the game is fine and that there are much more important areas for improvement than fictional tanks that are also a bit colorful and adhere to the same fictional arcade rules as a HESH spitting Death Star with a flaming yellow "camo". Lest we forget: T-34 tracks did not repair in 0.3 seconds while the tank was on fire in 1943. Blitz is not oriented toward historical buffs/purists. 

 

I'm not going to buy these tanks - unlike some of the critics who will - and doubt that they will add anything to my experience as a player. Nevertheless, I don't mind their existence in principle and hope that their introduction makes the Warhammer fans happy and keeps the lights on in Minsk (and Emeryville), because I generally enjoy Blitz as a lively game where I get to shoot pixel things. 

 

If you don't like these tanks - don't buy them. If you think they're significant setback for the game and stand for yet another step into the abyss  - don't buy anything. What signal does someone who says that the game is dying on the forums send to WG when he keeps on spending? The proof - and the truth - is in the dollar. 

 

  I was explaining my experience as to what happens when people in control listen to feedback and also what happens when you refuse to. It's the only real life example I've got. Thats how the Japanese do things, they analyze, collect data and attack issues. Are some ideas dumb? Yes. But they eventually realize it and change it, sometimes after the damage is already done. It always has to do with money but at least there's an explanation. We're just being told to embrace it and enjoy here whether we like it or not.

 

  It's no different than all of us giving our opinions on spare parts and then being told to use them because they wanted feed back so they could determine whether or not they needed to change anything. Look how well that turned out, it worked like a charm,

[Carrier_Lexington]

mastertanker28, on 23 September 2017 - 03:28 AM, said:

1. Stop putting in these fantasy tanks like bro what the heck we don't need fictional garbage like lupus or gundam tank

Yeah, those tank healthbars are so historical and non-fictional...

[willsoldier1]

As everyone else has plainly stated, STOP ADDING FICTIONAL TANKS. If you look at WG YT channel, in game chats, or even this thread, almost all of us hate it. The only time I see people defending these anime tanks are when I see gundam fans or anime lovers. Just listen to us instead of the money (it seems hard for you to do), because right now this is false advertising (WW2 game? yeah no). 

[Chariot_Solace]

Carrier_Lexington, on 23 September 2017 - 11:06 AM, said:

Yeah, those tank healthbars are so historical and non-fictional...

 

That's a game mechanic dude. Game mechanics aren't the same as a game's theme or storyline. This game is completely abandoning its theme. Good games don't do that.

[VikkoTheTusken]

Chariot_Solace, on 24 September 2017 - 12:00 AM, said:

This game is completely abandoning its theme. Good games don't do that.

 

 

[TigerBludt515]

Step one drop 40k plan immediately... LISTEN....! Don't do it..!
Step two: If you proceed there's (2) things to note: First create an opt out button for the silly little campaign ( not interested /. Do not solicit).. apply it. Secondly: Fix the problems with missing national tanks like the Italians lines and Japanese Heavies before putting in some Warhammer 40k fake tanks that mean absolutely nothing to a great part of us because we're realist.
Give Germany its Crosses like having to see Soviet stars. I didn't like the Cold War and the idea it's creeping up again!, Communism isn't cool..! Not every German is a nazi and the Crosses have being used since 1955 on. Don't like it?, then create a fantasy game where you can upgrade 7 generation back tanks into warhammers theater and call it something sci-fi who cares. You can have historical vehicles without proper markings fighting some fictional nonsense tanks because you all want to hide, be biased against, or straight out prejudice about? Can't have it both ways! Don't like historical accuracy and fairness but let's get some mess that looks like a Star Wars spinoff or something from Battlestar Galactica. For some of us that just ruins the appeal. Not interested. People ... you better listen. Timers are still on, glitches not fixed, tanks / TD's nerfed up, ping still blows ( almost every battle someone is saying it...so it's you WOTB ; it's you all's equipment not random or various players), matching is still jacked because most of the player base left, then you want to bring this mess on board when you all have 23 glitches and counting still going wrong. Your Non-Military Dis-Honor has hate attached to downvotes because a guy finds out who kills em and downvotes em ( I save my records to protect my account)... I use to get mad worried about penalties but now I realize they're badges of honor....yep .. you got it flipped right back at ya.!, support says they have no control over the so called Honor remarks and they can't change it as they have no power to... who'd you all sell out to? It's only hurting your player base and the WOTB economy. Teams now adays are doing good to get players that average maybe at best 3k+ on a team. Now you won't add real tanks but want to add warhammer 40k...? Somebody got them purse strings and you guys are fighting to get your income back up.... umm umm 3.8-4.1 wreckdates ummm ummm. Do whatever because you all will anyways. When authentic enthusiast are tired of seeing some moon beam fake 40k damage a good historic vehicle say goodbye to more players. The way all of this is going... I think this might finally do it in... Great solid effort on a self destruct oversight plan. Exemploarary Execution...It's pathetic

[Chariot_Solace]

War Gaming, I have loved this game and spent a fair amount of money on it, but every time you do something like this, I hate you a little more.

[TigerBludt515]

Let me rephrase a previous posting with a little more concise explanation:
  I see the other tanks with their markings but not the cross on anything German. Well.. it's on the modern equipment again today and has been since 1955. Russians have the Red Stars on the KV-1 and some similarities on others. Did or has anyone forgotten the Cold War or the very real renewal of a modern Soviet threat? Is Communism the new cool now..maybe I'm offended by that concept. Don't want Historical Markings on actual Historical Vehicles.. then get out of the business. You can't have it both ways. It's bias and with the cross on equipment today to be point blank it's prejudice. It's still labeling All Germans as Nazis and still saying History needs to be hidden. Again, you can't have it both ways. As for these Star Wars like 40k series some of what I saw mentioned lasers...? Really? Against tanks from 7 generations ago.?! All of it is getting outrageous.! Then to top it off you all still haven't listened about timers. Haven't fixed ghost shells, haven't fixed ping, haven't fixed targets disappearing and just about all teams are talking about in battle each time ( so it's you WOTB ) not your players equipment.! Good tanks and TD's nerfed out as. I have about (5) I won't touch now. Still won't make premiums as premium ready so why buy..? and then to make matters worse players from multiple regions still can't communicate. I've been suggesting an autotranslator for like 21 months now... still nothing! As for your Non- Military Dis-Honor system you all incorporated; you've been being informed thatnits been being abused by salty downvotes because someone gets whacked in a fight. I used to get super angry about it... now ... I realize they're badges of real Honor.! So go ahead.. keep em Installed. I keep records when I've performed and been downvoted to protect my account.! Which brings me to another point. Supoort says they have no control over erroneous negatives placed against a player and won't discuss who does. So... WOTB ; who'd you have to sell out to for a development team outside of wotb to hurt WOTB 's player base? Answer that straight up and own it.! There's not a(n) elephant in the room..there's a herd trampling on the fine rugs that onced sprawled the floor and the China that dressed the shelves. 4th point of contact extract....

[Mdog51]

Excited about new tanks. Got the Helsing and Dracula last go round.  Both are fun Helsing is one of my go to tanks