Jump to content


Top vs Bottom Tier tracking for a month. What I found out surprised me.

Top Tier Bottom Tier Win Rate

  • Please log in to reply
24 replies to this topic

_Weeping_Angel_ #1 Posted 06 September 2017 - 12:31 AM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 44676 battles
  • 1,504
  • [501DV]
  • Member since:
    02-09-2015

I took a month and compiled some simple stats about the games I played. Every once in awhile we see people on the forums rant and get angry about bottom tier matches etc. so I was just curious. I play mostly tier VI up to X. For this experiment I took out tier X because there is no way to become bottom tier. I played for about a month and kept track of each tank, if I was top or bottom tier, and win or loss for each match. This is back in January before my great hiatus. I got the STRV and Fury so I did end up playing more tier 6 than normal to get use to these new tanks. At my stage of playing (over 32k games) I tend to mostly play tanks I like vs The dreaded tank grinding to get the next tank.  This lends to me playing way more premium tanks that other tanks.

 

My questions coming into this experiment.

1. What percentage of games am I top vs. bottom tier in a match?

2. Does my win rate (WR) vary at each tier based on being top vs. bottom?

3. Any variance between tiers for any of this Win/loss or top/bottom tiers?

 

Here is the data about games played as top vs bottom tiers...

 

  Games Top Tier Bottom Tier

Percentage

Total 1003 538 465 .536
Tier 9 106 60 46

.566

Tier 8 239 142 97 .594
Tier 7 358 172 186 .480
Tier 6 300 164 136 .546

 

Notes:

Longest top tier streak - 12 games

Longest bottom tier streak - 14 games

Best day top tier - 26 of 36 games as top tier

Worst day top tier - 13 of 36 games as top tier

 

Observations and thoughts 

1. I was not overly surprised that tier 8 was the highest top tier rating as I tend to play almost exclusively premium tanks at tier 8 (IS-6, KV-5, T54 mod.1, O-47, Defender, etc.) to grind credits. They may not have complete top tier only status but it seems like they can pull top tier more often than not.

2. Tier 7 gets the lowest percentage due to overcrowded tier 8. I think tier 7 tanks get dragged into the very crowded tier 8 waiting list. There are a ton of great tanks at tier 7 but most players grind credits at tier 8 so you can get pulled up more often to keep clearing out the waiting times for tier 8 players.  Looking at the combined stats of tier 7 and 8 it appears to be true.

 

Here is some of the data I compiled over the month for win rate (WR)....

 

  WR Top WR Bottom WR Total

Total Games - 949 gms

.615 .647 .630

Tier 9 - 99 games

.596 .702

.638

Tier 8 - 217 games .553 .632 ​.585
Tier 7 - 334 games .631 .649 ​.640
Tier 6 - 299 games .668 .647 .655

 

Observations and thoughts

1. I had a better win rate as bottom tier at almost EVERY tier.  I did not really see that coming.  I though as a good player I could carry more often as a top tier tank as I punish the weaker tanks.  Guess I was wrong.

2. Skills pay off more as bottom tier.  Making sure you are in a position to help the team as a bottom tier tank will help you win more games.  You can sway more pulling your weight as a bottom tier where lots of players struggle to contribute substantially in a match. Skillz pay da billz. 

3. I am a little surprised at my WR as top tier at tier 8.  I only win .553 percent of the time?  I might be overly aggressive as top tier in the beastly IS-6 and Defender so I actually die more than I realize. I may have to go back and look at that tier's stats and see what was going on.  I will update when I get a chance to look a little closer at that tier.

4. Looking at my daily logs I noticed I tended to stick to a tier when I got hot. Some days I did not even play a single game a one tier and have 15 to 25 games at another. That may be a secret to winning more. Having the ability to read the player base at the time and going to where the games are best suited for you to win.

 

If anyone wants individual tank info I can compile it but I won't bother listing each tank individually on here.  Please note these stats were done back in January before I took my break from the game so some of the newer premium tanks I either don't have or didn't play during this period of time. Hope you find this as interesting as I did.

 

What I learned

1. This experiment slowed down my game play.  I watched each match to the end. I think I learned a lot by watching and having that time to think about what I did wrong, if anything, when I died before the end of the match. I also stuck around trying to help teammates with comments.  I think I ended up helping several game become a win by calling out spots or advice during the ends of games.

2. MM is not rigged.  I expected to be a little over .500 due to honeymoon phases of new tanks and the like.  It was nice to see that it was pretty balanced over the long haul even if there were some really good and bad days mixed in.

3. Skills pay off more when you are bottom tier.  Side scraping, Making sure your shots pen and deal damage. Moving to advantageous spots. Map awareness.  These all come into play even more when bottom tier.  It is not a fluke when it happened at all the tiers I played at.  Fear a good player who is in a bottom tier tank.  They will influence the game more than being in the top tier. 


Edited by _Weeping_Angel_, 06 September 2017 - 03:04 AM.


WizoGT379 #2 Posted 06 September 2017 - 12:46 AM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 6999 battles
  • 1,874
  • [RUDY]
  • Member since:
    07-08-2016

Wow, lol mind if I borrow these results for my neighborhood "science fair" (mostly old timers like me and some others)

 

+1


I’m sampling the retiree life, of Blitz, not sure if I’ll be returning, but thanks for all of your advice and fun.

 

You can't outsmart stupid, it just doesn't work like that - TengenToppaPotatoLagann


olddatsunfan #3 Posted 06 September 2017 - 12:56 AM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 33940 battles
  • 2,616
  • [-CFR-]
  • Member since:
    06-02-2015
Nice study, thanks!

WriterDude #4 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:11 AM

    My Posts Are Forum Prammo

  • Players
  • 23047 battles
  • 4,373
  • Member since:
    10-09-2014

Out of upvotes, but this is the kind of thing I love love LOVE to see here at the Forums. Good job!

 


Worthy of focus fire by SPUDX.  Potato Cred Link

  

"In Blitz, there's a certain value in expeditiously moving to the inevitable." -WriterDude


ShootinSabot #5 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:41 AM

    Senior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 18124 battles
  • 804
  • [SPUDX]
  • Member since:
    12-02-2016
Great post OP. Lots of food for thought.
  It can feel like we are always bottom tier when things are going badly, but I am glad you have confirmed it is even.
Did you notice any changes in the length of the streaks you were bottom tier vs top tier or was that also random?
Thanks for taking the time to put this together and sharing it with us.

                                                             

                                                                                Full time Spud, part time potato 

                                                                  Striving to be an Ambassador to help grow the game. 


reluctanttheist #6 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:44 AM

    Canuck Didactics

  • Players
  • 23117 battles
  • 6,040
  • [III-H]
  • Member since:
    01-12-2015

Damn!  Post of the month!!

 

+1 to you for the analysis and for blowing up tinfoil hats everywhere! :great:


Tanks:  _X: T110E5, T110E3, FV215b(183), IS-7, Obj.140  _IX: M103, T-54  _VIII: IS-6, T34, Lowe, T-44, IS-6, IS-3D  _VII: T-43, Comet, E25, AT-15A, SU-122-44
Usually on in the evenings Pacific time.  Intake Contact for Triarii Clan (PM for details)
Be a better player  |  Click here if you have lag  |  Graphics Settings for iOS  |  Check your ping with Pingplotter  |  Get good: watch Bushka!  |  Check out tanks on Tank Compare  and  BlitzHangar


_Weeping_Angel_ #7 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:55 AM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 44676 battles
  • 1,504
  • [501DV]
  • Member since:
    02-09-2015

View PostShootinSabot, on 05 September 2017 - 07:41 PM, said:

Great post OP. Lots of food for thought.
It can feel like we are always bottom tier when things are going badly, but I am glad you have confirmed it is even.
Did you notice any changes in the length of the streaks you were bottom tier vs top tier or was that also random?
Thanks for taking the time to put this together and sharing it with us.

,

Looking back at the daily logs most streaks were in the 5 to 8 range. I only had three streaks over 10 games. I had the 12 top tier streak.  I had a 14 and 11 bottom tier streak.  There were definitely more than one day when things were rough and it seemed like you were never top tier and others when you could always be on top tier.  What surprised me the most is after I was done and finally did the percentages...  It didn't matter for my win rate.  I actually play better as bottom tier so now I don't really care if I am top or bottom now.  That is mostly why I am posting this after such a long time of doing the work.  I think it is important to show others that it didn't matter if I was top or bottom tier.  I was actually winning more when bottom.  That kind of takes all the steam away from the complainers.  One thousand games is enough to show that it is not really a fluke due to small sample size.


Edited by _Weeping_Angel_, 06 September 2017 - 02:15 AM.


ShootinSabot #8 Posted 06 September 2017 - 06:35 AM

    Senior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 18124 battles
  • 804
  • [SPUDX]
  • Member since:
    12-02-2016
Yea the higher winrate as bottom tier is very surprising. That is the biggest nugget I took out of this whole post also. I need to do a little introspection on my own play style and incorporate some of the bottom tier fear into my driving even when top tier. 

                                                             

                                                                                Full time Spud, part time potato 

                                                                  Striving to be an Ambassador to help grow the game. 


Spekulatius #9 Posted 06 September 2017 - 11:23 AM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 30062 battles
  • 1,690
  • [III-S]
  • Member since:
    06-29-2014
I am a little surprised that you got a higher percentage pulling top Tier than expected, can this really be explained by the honeymoon phase, which gives you ~6 games as top Tier with a new tank. And this is even with playing Tier 7 a lot, if yo avoided that Tier, you batting average for Top Tier would have been 56.7%, which is significantly higher than the expected 50%.

Community pledge signer


r3cursion #10 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:54 PM

    Junior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 34363 battles
  • 233
  • [-DD-]
  • Member since:
    06-19-2016

Clearly a planted post...you are WG employee:)

 

Seriously tho, great post.



Ruby_Rose_ #11 Posted 06 September 2017 - 01:58 PM

    I don't need help growing up! I Drink Milk!

  • Players
  • 13449 battles
  • 2,420
  • [FLOOP]
  • Member since:
    09-14-2013
+1
I just play to play my games.
But nice to know about these facts.

Edited by Ruby_Rose_, 06 September 2017 - 01:59 PM.


Made by Panbun

"Efficiency is Just Clever Laziness" 

Want a RWBY signature? Here

 

 


_Weeping_Angel_ #12 Posted 06 September 2017 - 02:08 PM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 44676 battles
  • 1,504
  • [501DV]
  • Member since:
    02-09-2015

Here is Tier 8 stats for month

 

Tank Top Tier W/L Bottom Tier W/L

Games Top vs Bottom

Panther II 13/7 4/2 20/6
RU251 3/4 3/2 7/5
O-47 9/10 10/6 19/16
T59 8/2 7/3 10/10
T54 mod 1 13/9 12/4 22/16
Defender 5/12 5/5 17/10
IS-6 10/3 4/4 13/8
T34 3/1 0/1 4/1
T54 lt wt 1/4 3/3 5/6
KV-5 3/2 1/1 5/2
T69 2/1 5/0 3/5
Sup Persh 4/5 6/6 9/12
Lowe 1/0 0/1 1/1

 

My Panther II had an insane top tier percentage.  I did not try anything to pull it up like only play it after a game when I was bottom tier.  I figured the IS-6 would pull more top tier games but was mildly surprised who many top tier games the Defender and T54 mod 1 got.  I know that when I start to look at an individual tank there will be smaller sample sizes so variances can play a bigger part.  That is why I didn't really look at any individual tanks in the OP.

 

I also had a really bad month in the defender as top tier considering my overall WR is close to 60% in the tank.

 

View PostSpekulatius, on 06 September 2017 - 05:23 AM, said:

I am a little surprised that you got a higher percentage pulling top Tier than expected, can this really be explained by the honeymoon phase, which gives you ~6 games as top Tier with a new tank. And this is even with playing Tier 7 a lot, if yo avoided that Tier, you batting average for Top Tier would have been 56.7%, which is significantly higher than the expected 50%.

 

Before we switched to +1/-1 match making some tanks were bought because they pulled almost exclusively top tier matches.  I figured some of those tanks would still get a higher top tier pull even like around 60% so I wasn't surprised to see some tanks do just that.  If you take out the month I had in the Panther II the stats would look very different.


Edited by _Weeping_Angel_, 06 September 2017 - 02:14 PM.


mriversinco #13 Posted 06 September 2017 - 02:10 PM

    Sergeant

  • Players
  • 37852 battles
  • 322
  • [III-R]
  • Member since:
    12-27-2014

Excellent data collection and while I never thought about your analysis of being bottom tier and being able to "help" more than most, it's logical and makes sense.  Totally agree!!!!

 

Well done!



dindincf #14 Posted 06 September 2017 - 09:02 PM

    Potato Rights Activist

  • Players
  • 22383 battles
  • 2,334
  • [CLEAR]
  • Member since:
    08-31-2014
But hey lets nerf the s**t outa prammo alpha and pen on tier 7 vehicles.  Seeing as though you are bottom tiered in tier 7 nearly 60% of the time that makes great sense.  Don't want to compete with the nubs driving IS-X's

  https://www.blitzstars.com/player/com/dindincf                                            

#bringtankboomback

Tier X's: Leopard 1 / T110E4 /  T110E5 /  M48A1 Patton / Object 263 / IS-7 / Object 140 / T-62A / JPE-100 / AMX 50B

“At the moment, you should forget about the M60.”        -ZIoydd, on 01 August 2017 - 06:01 AM

 


_Brianna141 #15 Posted 07 September 2017 - 03:26 AM

    BananaBriannaBrian141

  • Players
  • 21178 battles
  • 531
  • [PURPL]
  • Member since:
    04-08-2016

I know this one glitch where you can always be top tier

 

you swipe all the way to most right to your favourite(Russian preferred) tech tree, spill 25ml of goat blood on your screen, along with half a bottle of vodka, then get naked, wrap yourself in a USSR flag, tune the soviet national anthem all the way up, then do the Russian dance while bathing yourself in the other half of vodka

 

if u get lucky, u can summon serb's blessing buff and always be top tier(of course u buy a tier 10 xd)

 

but jokes aside, that's interesting and thanks for taking your time collecting data o7



ShootinSabot #16 Posted 07 September 2017 - 03:55 AM

    Senior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 18124 battles
  • 804
  • [SPUDX]
  • Member since:
    12-02-2016

Brianna141, on 06 September 2017 - 08:26 PM, said:

I know this one glitch where you can always be top tier

 

you swipe all the way to most right to your favourite(Russian preferred) tech tree, spill 25ml of goat blood on your screen, along with half a bottle of vodka, then get naked, wrap yourself in a USSR flag, tune the soviet national anthem all the way up, then do the Russian dance while bathing yourself in the other half of vodka

 

if u get lucky, u can summon serb's blessing buff and always be top tier(of course u buy a tier 10 xd)

 

but jokes aside, that's interesting and thanks for taking your time collecting data o7

 

:teethhappy: Really, I going to try it but I need a goat first so it mine be a bit. 

 


Edited by ShootinSabot, 07 September 2017 - 03:55 AM.

                                                             

                                                                                Full time Spud, part time potato 

                                                                  Striving to be an Ambassador to help grow the game. 


ecpgieicg #17 Posted 07 September 2017 - 04:04 AM

    Junior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 25912 battles
  • 111
  • [PRAMO]
  • Member since:
    07-15-2012

Good post.

 

A minor objection: 

 

Block Quote

 MM is not rigged.

 

It totally is. I am top tier a lot more. And apparently, you are too.

 



CA_vampire #18 Posted 07 September 2017 - 04:22 AM

    Senior Sergeant

  • Players
  • 20588 battles
  • 904
  • [MOM4]
  • Member since:
    11-21-2016

Perhaps as a bottom tier you are more cautious and that's why you win more.

 

Perhaps in general in wotb, it is much more advantageous to be cautious... 



BuckGrizzly #19 Posted 07 September 2017 - 01:38 PM

    Sergeant

  • Players
  • 23266 battles
  • 319
  • [KR0N0]
  • Member since:
    04-25-2015
Great post! I think one of the reasons you might be winning more as bottom tier is that when you're top tier you become over confident, I know that is how it is for me. Also, when you're bottom you tend to be more subtle and the enemy tend to not view you as a great threat atm. Again this is what I experienced myself not necessarily fact. Great post +1

Jellotree76 #20 Posted 07 September 2017 - 01:55 PM

    First Sergeant

  • Players
  • 49478 battles
  • 1,261
  • [IRONZ]
  • Member since:
    01-05-2015

Great post WA! 

 

Having a high battle count like yourself, I have also noticed MM trends that are beyond what could be dismissed as anomalies. There's more at play in the MM system than simple randomness. 


 

NA damage record holder for the Jg.Pz.E100 (because I camped and the reds ran into my shells) 

All GRILLES MUST DIE!! 





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users