1992 replies to this topic

[CarnageAF]

Did some steamrolling, so get ready for the people about to come here to complain. 

[_Crusader6_]

Wrong thread 

[j_rod]

_Crusader6_, on 20 July 2021 - 10:17 PM, said:

Had AntoineDodson on red in his Kranvagn on Middleburg. 
    Strangely he took a hulldown approach and didn’t yolo into the open like our green Kran did. 
He crushed us as my WZ-121 couldn’t hold there and the rest of my team was busy doubling as melted butter at a Red Lobster 

Wrong thread old man

[_Crusader6_]

j_rod, on 21 July 2021 - 03:09 AM, said:

Wrong thread old man

yeah I just noticed 

[CarnageAF]

_Crusader6_, on 20 July 2021 - 09:17 PM, said:

Wrong thread 

It means that people will complain about matchmaking putting them against pro steamrollers...

Edited by CarnageAF, 21 July 2021 - 06:53 PM.

[dangerousdan26]

Matchmaking is as poor as ever even after the so-called "improvement".  Until such time as MM considers win rate, most especially as amplified in platoons, MM will be poor at best.

I have played many games where there are two opposing platoons.  Although the opposing platoons are roughly equivalent tiers and types, they are oiften far apart in win rate.  Last game after we had been destroyed 7-0, I looked at esults and noted the WR on my team's platoon was 40%.  They opposing platoon was 60% WR.  The outcome is predictable.  WOTB doesn't like to hear complaints about MM so this will probably be erased. 

[j_rod]

dangerousdan26, on 14 August 2021 - 07:07 PM, said:

Matchmaking is as poor as ever even after the so-called "improvement".  Until such time as MM considers win rate, most especially as amplified in platoons, MM will be poor at best.

I have played many games where there are two opposing platoons.  Although the opposing platoons are roughly equivalent tiers and types, they are oiften far apart in win rate.  Last game after we had been destroyed 7-0, I looked at esults and noted the WR on my team's platoon was 40%.  They opposing platoon was 60% WR.  The outcome is predictable.  WOTB doesn't like to hear complaints about MM so this will probably be erased. 

#professionaltroll

[_Crusader6_]

dangerousdan26, on 14 August 2021 - 08:07 PM, said:

Matchmaking is as poor as ever even after the so-called "improvement".  Until such time as MM considers win rate, most especially as amplified in platoons, MM will be poor at best.

I have played many games where there are two opposing platoons.  Although the opposing platoons are roughly equivalent tiers and types, they are oiften far apart in win rate.  Last game after we had been destroyed 7-0, I looked at esults and noted the WR on my team's platoon was 40%.  They opposing platoon was 60% WR.  The outcome is predictable.  WOTB doesn't like to hear complaints about MM so this will probably be erased. 

I don’t see the MM issue there.  
   What I see is a poor player that refuses to accept responsibility for their poor play. 
 Furthermore then wants to be carried to more wins by removing random from MM. 

 

 

[JefeMac]

Something has definitely changed from my perspective (and not for the better) in terms of queue times. TT or Premiums it’s taking as long as 10 mins to get into a battle every day/night, yet the results are the same as always so I’m really unsure what changed but something has. Never had queue times like these in 7+ yrs of playing Blitz. 

[wrecker1968]

JefeMac, on 15 August 2021 - 04:42 AM, said:

Something has definitely changed from my perspective (and not for the better) in terms of queue times. TT or Premiums it’s taking as long as 10 mins to get into a battle every day/night, yet the results are the same as always so I’m really unsure what changed but something has. Never had queue times like these in 7+ yrs of playing Blitz. 

 I've heard rumors that Things change after 5500 battles or so. Not sure how true this is.

Edited by wrecker1968, 15 August 2021 - 01:26 PM.

[wrecker1968]

_Crusader6_, on 15 August 2021 - 03:45 AM, said:

I don’t see the MM issue there.  
   What I see is a poor player that refuses to accept responsibility for their poor play. 
 Furthermore then wants to be carried to more wins by removing random from MM. 

 

 

 Who is considered a poor player? Especially when the average player is under 50% win rate. The average player does not have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of Ace masteries. Maybe it's time to step down off You're pedostal and Walk among the peasants that you are trying to govern "King crusader" All I am saying is maybe you should step outside the Box and try to see it from a average person's point of view.

[_Crusader6_]

wrecker1968, on 15 August 2021 - 08:36 AM, said:

 Who is considered a poor player? Especially when the average player is under 50% win rate. The average player does not have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of Ace masteries. Maybe it's time to step down off You're pedostal and Walk among the peasants that you are trying to govern "King crusader" All I am saying is maybe you should step outside the Box and try to see it from a average person's point of view.

Do a search of that poster.   He simply rants about MM every post he makes. 
   He wants skill based MM, which the game does not use, and has repeatedly said won’t be used. 
 

 

 

[__V_O_P__]

wrecker1968, on 15 August 2021 - 08:36 AM, said:

 Who is considered a poor player? Especially when the average player is under 50% win rate. The average player does not have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of Ace masteries. Maybe it's time to step down off You're pedostal and Walk among the peasants that you are trying to govern "King crusader" All I am saying is maybe you should step outside the Box and try to see it from a average person's point of view.

so to be clear... your argument is what now that the inmates should run the asylum? since most the common complaints about the game are from poor players blaming MM for getting bad teams. that's like blaming others for traffic: they are not stuck in traffic... they are traffic. similarly, they are not good players, held back by bad teams and bad MM, they are bad players, who refuse to work to get better at the game.  

[JefeMac]

wrecker1968, on 15 August 2021 - 01:36 PM, said:

 Who is considered a poor player? Especially when the average player is under 50% win rate. The average player does not have hundreds and hundreds and hundreds of Ace masteries. Maybe it's time to step down off You're pedostal and Walk among the peasants that you are trying to govern "King crusader" All I am saying is maybe you should step outside the Box and try to see it from a average person's point of view.

Best possible illustration of “critique” vs “critical.” 
 

Nice restraint Cru, I ain’t that gracious….

[wrecker1968]

__V_O_P__, on 15 August 2021 - 01:54 PM, said:

so to be clear... your argument is what now that the inmates should run the asylum? since most the common complaints about the game are from poor players blaming MM for getting bad teams. that's like blaming others for traffic: they are not stuck in traffic... they are traffic. similarly, they are not good players, held back by bad teams and bad MM, they are bad players, who refuse to work to get better at the game.  

 Nah I'm just saying that MM Is effective for players of your caliber but not the average player. I understand they should strive to be better .but obviously with all the complaints there must be some type of compromise. Because players like you and cru only make up less than 10% of total players in this game.

 Cru I was talking about matchmaking in general  (thread title)not one poor player.

Edited by wrecker1968, 15 August 2021 - 02:39 PM.

[j_rod]

wrecker1968, on 15 August 2021 - 08:36 AM, said:

 Nah I'm just saying that MM Is effective for players of your caliber but not the average player. I understand they should strive to be better .but obviously with all the complaints there must be some type of compromise. Because players like you and cru only make up less than 10% of total players in this game.

 Cru I was talking about matchmaking in general  (thread title)not one poor player.

I understand this argument and it’s what you see in other games where players of similar skill are matched against each other. It’s also what ratings is trying to accomplish.

 

The problem is that this approach is problematic when applied to Blitz for a variety of reasons.

 

1 - games are currently balanced by tank attributes (tier/class). If some sort of skill factor was added in, it would make balancing much harder and the queue times much longer 

 

2 - how does one define skill in a quantitative way such that it can be actually applied? Winrate? Average damage? Point being, any specific skill factor can be manipulated. Winrate can be manipulated by playing low tiers and super OP tanks. Average damage can be manipulated by only playing high tiers. So whatever method of determine skill is going to cause controversy and then there’s still the issue highlighted in point 1.

 

3 - we already have balanced MM in ratings and you see how problematic it can be. Why would this be any different?

 

There are a bunch more issues with skill balanced MM but I’m on my phone. 

[_Crusader6_]

wrecker1968, on 15 August 2021 - 09:36 AM, said:

 Nah I'm just saying that MM Is effective for players of your caliber but not the average player. I understand they should strive to be better .but obviously with all the complaints there must be some type of compromise. Because players like you and cru only make up less than 10% of total players in this game.

 Cru I was talking about matchmaking in general  (thread title)not one poor player.

Gotcha, 

   I am not thrilled with many of the current MM ‘rules’.  However, I’m also accepting that it’s WG’s game, and they can work MM to try to accomplish something that will serve most of the players with a relatively balanced team (via composition, which doesn’t necessarily mean balanced beyond anything past that) in a relatively quick manner that is appropriate for a mobile game.  
 

I also play War Thunder on computer - it uses an ELO method of a player ranking based on how they do in the previous 2 weeks. It’s actually worse IMHO than Blitz’s random method.  There are just as many if not more steamrolls in WT, even with respawn points you can generate to play your other tanks in that nation that are in your lineup. 
   You can wait for 10min to get a 6 per side game, or 5 min to get a 15+ /

side game - the large the games (player numbers) the greater the chance for a steamroll.  
 

WT ELO weights on how you rank in your team in games in that 2 week period, the more points for being higher on the team in a larger battle.   But if you are number 1 on a team of absolute muppets you get a bunch of points even if you aren’t very good or didn’t do great that game.   
 

Yes the current ‘random’ Blitz MM (random for player skill) serves better players better - but I don’t see anyone suggesting a better method that can practically be implemented.  
 

 

[j_rod]

_Crusader6_, on 15 August 2021 - 10:55 AM, said:

 

Yes the current ‘random’ Blitz MM (random for player skill) serves better players better - but I don’t see anyone suggesting a better method that can practically be implemented.  

This is where I am. I’m open to hearing other suggestions but have yet to hear one that seems practical. Not that we have any say over it, but this thread is the same tired argument over and over.

[Bafh29]

88 pages on the subject....

[j_rod]

Bafh29, on 16 August 2021 - 08:14 PM, said:

88 pages on the subject....

 

And no new material for 86 of them. For the people complaining, there's a pretty common trope - inability to overcome their teammates' deficiencies and the desire for WG to do it for them. 

 

This thread is the equivalent of people that can't ride a bike really well wanting everyone to have to use training wheels simply bc they struggle. 

Edited by j_rod, 17 August 2021 - 03:33 AM.