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RibbleStripe - does matchmaker analyze player skill?

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Dan_Deerso #41 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:37 AM

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View Postminitel_NA, on 15 February 2018 - 02:31 AM, said:

 

Last year I was trying to grind tier9, solo, from scratch, like I used to. T95, E75, and two more, all at once. 

 

My winrate after nearly 100 battles in each of them was around 38-45%.  worst : I still didn’t reach even half of the xp needed, simply because all of the losses and 7 green dead before I can even hit enemy twice.

 

so I started some study and here is the result : there are more people with tier10 in the queue, than tier9.

I looked up these numbers for months in the queue, and in blitzstars, and it was constantly the case.

Tier9 are further split to meet tier8 and tier 10. It made your chance of meeting tier8 very slim, and meeting tier10 meant that in that game there was a lot more tier 10 than tier 9. with stock tank and crew it was impossible to carry. 

 

This wasnt due to a curse against me : the  MM was unbalanced. but that was all the server population’s fault. Too many noobs flood tier10. 

 

After this I went to check other tiers, and ther are such unbalances over there as well, though maybe less noticeable, but to be noted for exemple at tier5 and 6 due to supremacy on/off, etc..

 

Exactly. You used to see large disparities in tiers 2, 4, 5, and 9 due to the tutorial, Supremacy, and tier 10 being flooded respectively.

 

Then Ranked came along (T9 and 10 only), and suddenly tier 8 was getting bottom tier a lot more, as most people only played Ranked in tier 10 to get the special boxes and a backrub from a Russian hooker, therefore starving MM of tier 10 tanks, forcing tier 9 to be top tier more often.

 

Now, with extended Ranked tiers, I expect the trend to be a lot more stretched out, but still observable at tier 6.



NoobieDude #42 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:38 AM

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View Postreluctanttheist, on 14 February 2018 - 11:22 PM, said:

Noobie, your youth is evident in your posts.  Don't be surprised that you're not being taken seriously.  Even your post above is a fail (Grammarly is a common browser add-on).  Your statements are generally indefensible.

 

"A house built on lies will fall."  A company that employs deception as a business practice - well, even its employees wouldn't be able to trust each other.  The whole thing goes down.  If WG employs skill-based MM when it says it does not, then the company cannot be trusted - internally or externally.  You call Ribble a corporate hack instead of acknowledging his competence as part of an industry-respected gaming company whose coding methodology is understood to be leading edge in the industry.  They have Youtube videos on their coding techniques.  It's wickedly boring.  It's also best in class.  Your derisive approach shows that you're too young and foolish to even comprehend the caliber the company you attempt to insult.  Your insults - and the logic you bring to the table - are so far short of the discussion on this topic that it shows that you don't even belong here.

so because you deem me insignificant . i can not have a opinion that is worthy of you're  intellectual status. i must leave and i don't lie as a rule.but yet i see others with the same opinion. there must be something that ive said that really has your panties in a bunch.you seem to single me out. it is curious isn't it?



reluctanttheist #43 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:40 AM

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 9 V, what you have is the gun, but the problem is there's no smoke.   We don't know if the gun has ever been fired. 

 

 The gun certainly does exist, but the general understanding is that the patent is for the PC version. Also, wargaming states that the matchmaker for the PC version is currently not skill-based. 


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minitel_NA #44 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:43 AM

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View Post9_V0LT, on 15 February 2018 - 07:01 AM, said:

 

 

Hey NSA, you guys don't listen in on my private phone calls, do you?

 

no they don’t... they didn’t record one entire year of communications from a friendly country for post analysis... wait... 

anyway if you don’t call they can’t record your mic... wait...

ok I’ll go back to my cave, and maybe sit on a log and... wait....


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reluctanttheist #45 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:43 AM

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 I give whole hearted attention and respect to anyone who shows respect. Fail to do that, and I will pay little attention to what you have to say. 

Tanks:  _X: T110E5, T110E3, FV215b(183), IS-7, Obj.140  _IX: M103, T-54  _VIII: IS-6, T34, Lowe, T-44, IS-6, IS-3D  _VII: T-43, Comet, E25, AT-15A, SU-122-44
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Dan_Deerso #46 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:46 AM

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View Post9_V0LT, on 15 February 2018 - 02:32 AM, said:

 

Maybe they do, maybe they don't.

They've never confirmed or denied it -which only encourages speculation.

I can't prove God exists and you can't prove he doesn't, 'cause God aint taking.

Without the ability to prove either position, both opinions are equally valuable and equally worthless.

 

They have a patent for a vibrator of all things, just thought I might point that out.

 

https://patents.google.com/patent/USD681225S1/en?assignee=Wargaming.net+LLP&page=3

 

Here's the patent for Military Honor, equally as useless:

https://patents.google.com/patent/US7169051B1/en?assignee=Wargaming.net+LLP

 

 


Edited by Dan_Deerso, 15 February 2018 - 07:48 AM.


reluctanttheist #47 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:48 AM

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 Great. Now there is a vibrator in my thread! :teethhappy:

 

 Seriously, Ribble you have to answer this thread before it gets any more weird :amazed:


Edited by reluctanttheist, 15 February 2018 - 07:51 AM.

Tanks:  _X: T110E5, T110E3, FV215b(183), IS-7, Obj.140  _IX: M103, T-54  _VIII: IS-6, T34, Lowe, T-44, IS-6, IS-3D  _VII: T-43, Comet, E25, AT-15A, SU-122-44
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minitel_NA #48 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:49 AM

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View PostDan_Deerso, on 15 February 2018 - 07:46 AM, said:

 

They have a patent for a vibrator of all things, just thought I might point that out.

 

https://patents.google.com/patent/USD681225S1/en?assignee=Wargaming.net+LLP&page=3

 

 

 

Hahahahaha !!!

wait, let me check if they use it ...

(looking behind myself) 

 

They do ! They do ! They do ! We are screwed !


Minitelrose visiting from EU, occasional player/forumer in the NA

 


NoobieDude #49 Posted 15 February 2018 - 07:55 AM

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View Postreluctanttheist, on 14 February 2018 - 11:43 PM, said:

 I give whole hearted attention and respect to anyone who shows respect. Fail to do that, and I will pay little attention to what you have to say. 

 

shoes fit on different feet dude. and ive seen some of you other posts.. slightly hypocritical id say. i went back to see how this all came about.

it started with me saying why anyone would listen to what a wg rep would have to say about there MM. and they should get a independent non bias game dev to explain there MM.

apparently you didn't like that . thats when you attacked me on my spelling? kinda disrespectful huh? this was in the other MM thread on lies and stats. you figure it out dude.. i really don't care a bout your opinions any more either. you lost my respect for sure. not that you give a fk. about my opinions any way...you do you boo... 07 GG


Edited by NoobieDude, 15 February 2018 - 08:15 AM.


9_V0LT #50 Posted 15 February 2018 - 08:33 AM

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Ever notice, if you lose two or three battles in a row and take a break for awhile, the trend seems to "reset" when you start playing again?

Yeah, I'm back. Let's not make a big deal about this.


9_V0LT #51 Posted 15 February 2018 - 08:47 AM

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View Postreluctanttheist, on 15 February 2018 - 07:40 AM, said:

 Also, wargaming states that the matchmaker for the PC version is currently not skill-based. 

 

The patent, as stated, doesn't use skill in it's decision making.

It uses only the outcome of the last few sets of sequential battles, to "nudge" you in a harder or easier direction. Of course, this also means other players get "nudged" around to accommodate the guy on the loosing streak. You can't have Ying without the Yang, if someone gets the nudge in the easier direction, then some other player is going to get the nudge in the harder direction.

 

The patent is a lot like what they use with slot machines.

If slot machines just took all your money, game after game, then no one would play them for long, so instead, they set the machines to pay out some of the money back. Lose three pulls in a row, and the next pull will let you win a little money back, which they hope you will dutifully put back in the slot. By letting you win just enough of your money back, to keep you at the machine, eventually, they'll take it all.

 

That's pretty much what Wargaming wants. 

They don't want you to get too discouraged, they want you to keep playing the game.

 

Honestly, I really don't care one way or the other. I don't have a dog in this fight.

I'm just curious.



reluctanttheist #52 Posted 15 February 2018 - 08:58 AM

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The problem with you Noobie is that you come off young, and then start dissing the company while not able to string anything together that looks like logic.  Everyone bandies about "rigged MM" with zero explanation or description of the mechanisms by which this might be done in this game.  No data either. Then you call Ribble a corporate hack.  Right!  Probably has 4x your IQ too.  That's a great way to make yourself look stupid.   

 

It's amazing to go search back in 2015 on this forum and see this tired old horse brought out again and again.  Heck, even Triarii figured MM had to be rigged when wins turned into losses and wins could not be found.  Gotta blame the casino, right... the house always wins.  Except there's no house, because MM is a zero sum game only for the players. 

 

I have not done a thorough scouring of the RU forums to see what WG has said on the topic.  I can strongly expect that it's been discussed thoroughly with snarky input from our developers.  Seems it may be time to do so.  


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NoobieDude #53 Posted 15 February 2018 - 09:05 AM

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the thing about you RT is you started this before i called the rep a hack. but im sorry i did so. but your just as wrong in this instance as i was ....nuff said...im done with you.

reluctanttheist #54 Posted 15 February 2018 - 09:11 AM

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View PostNoobieDude, on 15 February 2018 - 01:05 AM, said:

...but your just as wrong in this instance...

 

:facepalm:


Tanks:  _X: T110E5, T110E3, FV215b(183), IS-7, Obj.140  _IX: M103, T-54  _VIII: IS-6, T34, Lowe, T-44, IS-6, IS-3D  _VII: T-43, Comet, E25, AT-15A, SU-122-44
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Dan_Deerso #55 Posted 15 February 2018 - 09:22 AM

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Man, I love it when people try to insult RT. It's like they don't realize he's the biggest producer of constructive content here.

anonym_J0XpPXlUYiaj #56 Posted 15 February 2018 - 10:33 AM

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Howdy!

 

I have the answer how mm works. I have been trying to crack this code for a LONG time. After seeing changes in 3.9 in MM and there after, the answer is none of those you mentioned.

The answer lies in a certain meeting between 2 very important people. Those people; 

 

Stepan Deozd, and none other then Sergey Shoygu, General of Defense Ministry for Russia. Back in 2013 it was reported they were seen together at a dinner party in Sweden. Why Swenden? Who knows?! Point is multiple accounts are lead to believe WOTB is connected somehow. You know who else Stepan Deozd meet with shortly after at a foreign affairs Galla in Norway?

Donald Trump, who said, and I QUOTE, at the press conference shortly before,

“People just need to get back to work. Really. If the world is to move forward we all need to do our part. The machine cannot run, without spare parts.”

 

And then it hit me. The secret matchmaking which won’t be givin to us. The Russian bias in blitz. THE SPARE PARTS. The secret meetings! GUYS, it all makes sense. THE SIGNS ARE ALL THERE! MM CONTAINS THE BATTLE PLANS FOR RUSSIAS INVASION OF THE EU, or AMERICA, OR MAYBE THEY ARE WORKING SECRETLY TO HAVE US ALL DRIVE THEIR TANKS! GUYS WE GOTTA DO SOMETHING. THE UNICUMS IN BLITZ ARE IN DANGER! WE GOTTA TELL SOMEONE! WE GOTTA-

 

oh.  *Takes off tin-foil hat* 

Sorry g2g. Ancient Aliens is on.

Ferranzo



RibbleStripe #57 Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:06 AM

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View Postreluctanttheist, on 15 February 2018 - 08:35 AM, said:

Hey Ribble

 

There's a long time argument on the forums that MM makes games more difficult for players over a number of games.  The idea behind this is that MM looks at the skill of the players on the teams and puts higher-skilled players on the opposing team to make it harder for you to win.  

 

There are other players who have read before that MM does NOT analyze player skill, but may in fact place you as low-tier to offer you a greater challenge in a certain percentage of games that you play.  In this scenario, MM remembers how often you are low tier / high tier and manipulates how often you are low or high tier.

 

Finally, there's those who believe that MM is entirely random, and that MM simply grabs you and your tank to make up the team needed at that very millisecond that MM starts building teams for the next match for which you're available.

 

Who's right, and who's buying the other guys a beer?  If you can answer this question, I will heartily thank you!

 

I'm kind of surprised by such questions...
No, MM doesn't analyze skill. 

 

 


SpartacusDiablo #58 Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:12 AM

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View PostRibbleStripe, on 15 February 2018 - 06:06 AM, said:

 

I'm kind of surprised by such questions...
No, MM doesn't analyze skill. 

Shame that none of the players who think it does will believe this.  

 

Thanks for the answer RibbleStripe.


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66_75_63_6b_20_79_6f_75 #59 Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:28 AM

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View PostRibbleStripe, on 15 February 2018 - 05:06 AM, said:

 

I'm kind of surprised by such questions...
No, MM doesn't analyze skill. 

It’s pretty obvious skill would not be a factor.

Why calculate a variable into an Algo that is so minuscule among players.



minitel_NA #60 Posted 15 February 2018 - 11:32 AM

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View Postr0cKeT, on 15 February 2018 - 11:28 AM, said:

It’s pretty obvious skill would not be a factor.

Why calculate a variable into an Algo that is so minuscule among players.

Hahahaha ! 

Unfortunately, so true :/ . case close then thanks for bringing some sense into it all...


Edited by minitel_NA, 15 February 2018 - 11:40 AM.

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