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Will WG ever admit that the 30mm cannon on the VK 16.02 Leopard is OP?

Tier V Leopard Mk.103

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SanguinaryDan #1 Posted 12 June 2018 - 01:54 AM

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Of course that assumes that it actually is doesn’t it?  

 

Sadly, I have to think that it is. The Mk.103 30mm cannon is so over the top in rate of fire and penetration that it just doesn’t make sense. There might be two or three tanks across IV-VI that make a Leopard driver consider APCR. Maybe.  Usually they just move around to the side or rear of the target and AP goes straight through. And they have so much ammo and the clip reloads so quickly that they never seem to stop firing. 

 

I can’t imagine there is any Tier V tank that Tier IV players are more afraid of seeing in red. Hell, the damned thing is more dangerous than most Tier VI tanks. 

 

Please note that that I am not saying the Leopard itself needs to be nerfed. But the gun might need to be cut back to the same stats as on the Luchs.

 

If I’m wrong, I’m wrong. But I kind of doubt that I am. We’d see a lot more 50mm guns if I were.


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__Boomer2__ #2 Posted 12 June 2018 - 02:02 AM

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I'm pretty sure the Leo's gun got hit too when the Luchs got nailed.  But yea, they still shred tanks and a platoon of good players in Leos is terrifying.

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MudkipAtWar #3 Posted 12 June 2018 - 02:03 AM

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It's not op, anybody who knows what they are doing can fight off a leopard easily enough. It seems op because they prey on clueless seals at tier v

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Gavidoc01 #4 Posted 12 June 2018 - 02:26 AM

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IIic the gun used to have 10 shells and half the clip reload. Plus more turret and track traverse. It was ridiculous how broken OP it was when first released. The only thing that still makes it effective IS the 30 cm. Unlike the 28.01,the Leopard while good now is a shadow of its former self while the 28.01just went from OP to semi OP. 

 

I drive the crusader and beta sherman more at V now and don’t fear a leopard in either of those tanks. 


Edited by Gavidoc01, 12 June 2018 - 02:28 AM.

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dindincf #5 Posted 12 June 2018 - 04:51 AM

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View PostGavidoc01, on 11 June 2018 - 06:26 PM, said:

IIic the gun used to have 10 shells and half the clip reload. Plus more turret and track traverse. It was ridiculous how broken OP it was when first released. The only thing that still makes it effective IS the 30 cm. Unlike the 28.01,the Leopard while good now is a shadow of its former self while the 28.01just went from OP to semi OP. 

 

I drive the crusader and beta sherman more at V now and don’t fear a leopard in either of those tanks. 

 

The beta sherman deals with a leo more comfortably than any tank if I recall.


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kidthekid01 #6 Posted 12 June 2018 - 06:07 AM

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Beta Sherman?

dindincf #7 Posted 12 June 2018 - 06:12 AM

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View Postkidthekid01, on 11 June 2018 - 10:07 PM, said:

Beta Sherman?

 

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Afleet_Alex #8 Posted 12 June 2018 - 12:20 PM

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The pziv kills the Leopard with two shots with the derp gun.

 

And my pziv reloads in 9.2 seconds.

 

And the Leo takes 10.64 to reload the clip.

 

The Leo is no match for my pziv.


Edited by Afleet_Alex, 12 June 2018 - 12:23 PM.


Gavidoc01 #9 Posted 12 June 2018 - 12:35 PM

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View PostAfleet_Alex, on 12 June 2018 - 07:20 AM, said:

The pziv kills the Leopard with two shots with the derp gun.

 

And my pziv reloads in 9.2 seconds.

 

And the Leo takes 10.64 to reload the clip.

 

The Leo is no match for my pziv.

 

Yeah you ain't too shabby in it. Most PzIV players  get eaten alive by Leopards.

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SanguinaryDan #10 Posted 12 June 2018 - 12:38 PM

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I’m not saying the tank can’t be beaten or even that it is game breaking. I use my T14 a lot at Tier V and I can force bounces all day long if a Leopard driver is silly enough to come at me by himself. And any Leo driver will tell you that his armor only works against the worst of the stock Tier IV guns or after many sacrifices to RNGesus. 

 

My issue is with the high number of shells per clip of excellent penetration ammo combined with short clip reload and superb maneuverability. Together they make even a semi-competently driven Leopard much too powerful for a Tier V Light tank.

 

Actually I think that’s it.  The Leopard with MK.103 is in the wrong Tier. 


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cheasesteak #11 Posted 12 June 2018 - 01:45 PM

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Leo is balanced just fine. 

 

 

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dindincf #12 Posted 12 June 2018 - 01:56 PM

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View PostSanguinaryDan, on 12 June 2018 - 04:38 AM, said:

I’m not saying the tank can’t be beaten or even that it is game breaking. I use my T14 a lot at Tier V and I can force bounces all day long if a Leopard driver is silly enough to come at me by himself. And any Leo driver will tell you that his armor only works against the worst of the stock Tier IV guns or after many sacrifices to RNGesus. 

 

My issue is with the high number of shells per clip of excellent penetration ammo combined with short clip reload and superb maneuverability. Together they make even a semi-competently driven Leopard much too powerful for a Tier V Light tank.

 

Actually I think that’s it.  The Leopard with MK.103 is in the wrong Tier. 

 

95 (100 with CS) isn’t good pen at tier 5.

 

  • 120+ Great
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SanguinaryDan #13 Posted 12 June 2018 - 02:23 PM

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View Postdindincf, on 12 June 2018 - 08:56 AM, said:

 

95 (100 with CS) isn’t good pen at tier 5.

 

  • 120+ Great
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I’d agree if we were talking about a single shot gun on a Heavy or a Medium. But we’re talking about an autocannon with 12 shots on a fast Light. If you are shooting at the front of any target you are doing it wrong. :mellow:


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gordonchau #14 Posted 12 June 2018 - 02:53 PM

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View PostSanguinaryDan, on 12 June 2018 - 02:23 PM, said:

I’d agree if we were talking about a single shot gun on a Heavy or a Medium. But we’re talking about an autocannon with 12 shots on a fast Light. If you are shooting at the front of any target you are doing it wrong. :mellow:

if you are not using your front to face it or not tracking it you are wrong


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__Crusader6__ #15 Posted 12 June 2018 - 03:14 PM

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View Postgordonchau, on 12 June 2018 - 09:53 AM, said:

if you are not using your front to face it or not tracking it you are wrong

 

Bingo.

 

The KV-1 is by far the most broken tank in tier 5 ATM.

 

 


 

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cheasesteak #16 Posted 12 June 2018 - 04:05 PM

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View Post__Crusader6__, on 12 June 2018 - 03:14 PM, said:

 

Bingo.

 

The KV-1 is by far the most broken tank in tier 5 ATM.

 

 

 

​Pretty much.  Drive forward and shoot will get you wins more often than not. 

 

 

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Gavidoc01 #17 Posted 12 June 2018 - 04:06 PM

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View Post__Crusader6__, on 12 June 2018 - 10:14 AM, said:

 

Bingo.

 

The KV-1 is by far the most broken tank in tier 5 ATM.

 

 

 

Now that is an overstatement IMO. When a type t-34 can pen a KV front when slightly angled with ap it is not broken. 


Edited by Gavidoc01, 12 June 2018 - 04:07 PM.

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dindincf #18 Posted 12 June 2018 - 04:12 PM

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View PostSanguinaryDan, on 12 June 2018 - 06:23 AM, said:

I’d agree if we were talking about a single shot gun on a Heavy or a Medium. But we’re talking about an autocannon with 12 shots on a fast Light. If you are shooting at the front of any target you are doing it wrong. :mellow:

 

You could say that it’s pen isn’t an issue due to the excellent mobility and that would be a more accurate statement.  Or that it has good pen for an autoloader at the tier. Claiming that 95 pen is good is just wrong.

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Duke_87 #19 Posted 12 June 2018 - 05:23 PM

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While easy to win in the kv-1, IMO it is too slow to truly be OP. It relies on clueless red players.  The leo spatters you with an endless torrent of shells, maybe not always doing a ton of damage, but usually at least wracking up module damage left and right.  And unlike the kv-1 is fast enough to flex to respond to changing game conditions.  I am in the leo is still OP camp.

Edited by Duke_87, 12 June 2018 - 05:24 PM.

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SanguinaryDan #20 Posted 12 June 2018 - 05:36 PM

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View Postdindincf, on 12 June 2018 - 11:12 AM, said:

 

You could say that it’s pen isn’t an issue due to the excellent mobility and that would be a more accurate statement.  Or that it has good pen for an autoloader at the tier. Claiming that 95 pen is good is just wrong.

Semantics can be important or they can make you seem intentionally obtuse. Which way are you headed? ;)

 

As we all have seen, a tank that can easily outflank most anything it might face can do very well with 95mm of penetration. Therefore it is good for how it is used and what is using it.  And as I said, it’s not good on a single shot from a Medium or Heavy.  But quite good for a 12 round autoloading Light.

 

And if the Leopard is on my team please feel free to turn your turret and hull to track him. My TD, Heavy and Medium teammates thank you. Now consider the other Tier V Light tanks and wether or not you’d take that risk as they zip on by.  Would you turn for a Crusader? The Chaffee?  Probably not. But a Leopard with a full clip is a different kettle of fish, yes?  

 

If he gets a perfect strike he’ll average 300 damage.  That’s more than any other Tier V not firing 105mm HE. Any of the 105mm tanks move 60 kph and have 95mm of penetration on their HE?


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